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Rebeca Ibarra: This is The Takeaway. I am Rebeca Ibarra, host and producer of NPR and WNYC's Consider This, in for Tanzina Vega this week. It's great to be with you this Monday. Over the weekend, Charlotte Bennett, a former aide to Governor Andrew Cuomo, came forward with allegations of sexual harassment against the governor. Speaking to The New York Times, Bennett said that last spring, the governor repeatedly asked her invasive questions about her personal life.

In reference to one conversation she had with Cuomo in June, Bennett told The Times, "I understood that the governor wanted to sleep with me and felt horribly uncomfortable and scared." In response to the allegations, Governor Cuomo has released a statement that said that, "To be clear, I never inappropriately touched anybody and I never propositioned anybody and I never intended to make anyone feel uncomfortable, but these are allegations that New Yorkers deserve answers to."

We will have that full statement on the web. This came days after another former aide to Cuomo, Lindsey Boylan, published her own allegations of sexual harassment against the governor. The governor's press secretary called Boylan's claims false. Now a number of New York politicians on both the right and the left are calling for Cuomo to resign. Meanwhile, Cuomo has come out in support of an investigation into the allegations, but the governor was further criticized for initially appointing a judge with ties to one of his advisors to oversee the probe.

These allegations come as Governor Cuomo also faces a backlash over his alleged role in the cover-up surrounding the number of deaths in New York's nursing homes at the beginning of the pandemic. On the other side of the country, another governor who was initially praised for his handling of COVID-19 has also come under fire recently. California Governor Gavin Newsom is facing the possibility of a potential recall election later this year, which would give voters the chance to replace him.

Newsom's critics are using the anger caused by his stay-at-home orders and the confusion with California's vaccine rollout to fuel momentum for the recall. Breaking down the backlash governors are facing is where we start today on The Takeaway. We're joined by my colleague, Gwynne Hogan, a reporter for WNYC and Gothamist. Gwynne, great to have you here.

Gwynne Hogan: Hi.

Rebeca: We're also joined by Phil Willon, staff writer for The LA Times covering Gavin Newsom and California politics. Phil, thank you for being here.

Phil Willon: Hi, thanks for having me.

Rebeca: Gwynne, let's start with you. We mentioned that two former aides to Governor Cuomo have now accused him of sexual harassment. Can you tell us what we know about these allegations so far?

Gwynne: Sure. In the last week, two women have come forward to describe sexual harassment while working in Governor Cuomo's office. Earlier last week, Lindsey Boylan came forward with a post that she wrote on Medium. She had alluded to this sexual harassment in a tweet last December but she declined further interviews at the time.

Now last week she wrote a lengthy account where she described in the years that she worked in the governor's office, a series of uncomfortable incidents that culminated with a forcible kiss when she was trying to leave his office one day. She said that the governor would try or went out of his way to touch her lower back and legs and one time suggested that they play strip poker as a joke when they were sitting very close to one another on a jet during a state trip. After she released her account on Medium, three days later the second woman came forward.

She's a 25-year-old staffer named Charlotte Bennett. She doesn't allege that the governor forcibly touched her, but she says that he made a series of comments that made her feel deeply uncomfortable in the work setting. She says that he said he liked to date women in their 20s, that he suggested one time that she get a tattoo on her buttocks and asked her at the height of the pandemic, when was the last time that she really had a hug?

Now, like you said, he denied the first allegations that Lindsey Boylan described and says that he never touched anyone in any inappropriate way, but with the second allegation, he admits that some of his comments may have been interpreted as flirtation and he never meant to intimidate anyone.

Rebeca: Do we know what drove these women to speak up?

Gwynne: It seems that all of this has snowballed since late January, after a damning report that came out from the state attorney general on how the governor had handled the nursing home crisis last year during the height of the pandemic. In the wake of that, he lashed out at somebody who was criticizing him, an assemblyman, Ron Kim. When Ron Kim came forward and told New Yorkers that he received a threatening phone call from the governor, all of these stories have bubbled up in the week sense.

Rebeca: There was also some controversy over the weekend because of how Cuomo handled the potential investigation into these allegations. Where do things stand there?

Gwynne: Right. First the governor said, "I support an investigation," and named a political ally to do it. There was immediate backlash, including from the New York state Attorney General Letitia James. Then he said, okay, New York state Attorney General Letitia James and one of the state's top judges will conduct the investigation together.

The attorney general pushed back on that as well, demanding that he allow her to do a thorough and independent investigation and because of state law, he has to authorize it in order for her to have subpoena power. They went back and forth in dueling press statements over the course of Sunday and finally he relented and he said that he would grant this referral. She says she expects to receive subpoena power and the power to conduct this investigation solely.

Rebeca: Let's step back in time to last spring. Can you tell us how Governor Cuomo handled the beginning stages of the pandemic?

Gwynne: You may remember, Governor Cuomo stepped into what was at the time a dearth of national leadership. At a time when President Trump was actively downplaying the severity of COVID-19, Governor Andrew Cuomo was leveling with the nation in these daily public briefings, with endearing PowerPoint presentations that made people giggle.

He told people that the situation was serious in New York but that if we band together, we would get through it together. It was a message that really resonated with people. It resonated with people within New York and all across the country and frankly, the world at the height of the pandemic. He was getting letters from all over the country thanking him for his leadership and he even won an Emmy for his press briefings.

Rebeca: Phil, what about Governor Newsom? How did he handle the beginning stages of the pandemic?

Phil: Just like Governor Cuomo, Gavin Newsom got a lot of praise for his initial actions. California was the first state in the nation to issue a statewide stay at home order. That was in mid-March, even before that. I don't know if you remember, but we had that big cruise ship off the coast that came in and we had some planes come in from Wuhan as well.

California was already getting a taste of the initial stages of the pandemic before things started to go crazy out here on the West Coast. It was nothing like what hit the Northeast, but Newsom again, he had daily briefings just like Governor Cuomo. He got a lot of praise. His job approval rating went through the roof and a lot of the initial actions actually did pretty well. California has a relatively low COVID death rate compared to other states in the nation still.

Rebeca: What was the public's response to Governor Newsom and how he handled the pandemic?

Phil: Initially it was really good. I think like the people across the country, people didn't know what this virus was doing. There was a lot of fear about the potential. There were a lot of unknowns. He got a lot of support for what he was doing and a lot of praise. Over time in New York and across the country, people started to chafe with all the restrictions. They got tired of having their kids having to do distance learning. They got tired of having to work from home.

We had millions of people out of work. Businesses were closed. The economic devastation was real, just like it has been everywhere. After a couple months, after the initial shock of this deadly virus, people just started to get a lot more impatient on a lot of the policies and so you saw his favorability rating steadily decline.

Rebeca: Now both politicians are facing political backlash. Gwynne, can you tell us about Governor Cuomo's relationships with politicians in his state during the pandemic? How did he work with them?

Gwynne: He initially received a lot of support from local politicians. The state legislator granted him these additional emergency powers at the beginning of the pandemic, because everybody realized that the situation was so dire and that he needed to take sweeping executive actions in order to handle it. Like Phil described, that patience has kind of wore as the pandemic has gone on. Legislators started asking in last summer for basic data, like how many people had died in nursing homes and basically were stonewalled. That's created tension and it's really snowballed, like I said, in the last few weeks, where now we're seeing all different kinds of things in consideration, from removing those emergency powers to some really progressive politicians and people on the right actually are now calling for impeachment or his resignation. We've seen that that relationship really has strained.

Rebeca: Phil, what about Governor Newsom? How has his relationship with elected officials changed from beginning to now?

Phil: It was pretty rosy at the beginning and especially with local health officials and local county officials. That began to deteriorate as time went on. The Newsom administration was accused of having a muddied message about what they wanted, not consulting with local health officials or local politicians when they implement new policies such as we have a tiered system about when some restrictions can be lifted. There were plans about the vaccine rollout that some of the local officials said they weren't consulted with.

On the legislative side, the biggest criticism has been some of the contracts that have gone out. Basically, we've been spending billions of dollars for PPE and other measures and the criticism is that he's done no bid contracts. There's been questions raised about if some of these companies have prior relationships with them or had supported him politically, but that has not been as serious as back in New York, I don't think. It's been kind of a little bubbling below the surface a little more from the legislative point of view. With local governments, it's been a big problem.

Rebeca: Can you tell us about the now infamous French Laundry restaurant incident and why people were so angry?

Phil: This happened in November. Newsom was caught basically by a patron there, snapped a picture of him dining with friends at The French Laundry, which is a very posh restaurant in the Napa Valley. This was at the same time he was urging Californians not to gather in big groups, not to congregate with people outside their home. It was like a tinderbox.

People got really upset because we'd been in lockdown since March and here was the governor not wearing a mask, with his friends, hobnobbing in this swanky restaurant. I guess under the rules in Napa at the time you could dine outside restaurants, but it was just seen as a total hypocritical move on his part and he still really hasn't recovered from that. That added fuel to this budding recall effort out here, which looks like it's going to qualify for the ballot.

Rebeca: Can you explain what this recall effort means?

Phil: This began last June. To recall the statewide politician in California, you need to get just under 1.5 million signatures and the proponents say they have over that already. We don't know if those are valid signatures, they have to be from California voters so it has to go through a check process. What looks like is going to happen is it looks like it will qualify and come October, November, there will be a recall election, a special election with two questions. One, should Gavin Newsom be recalled and if he is recalled, who would you like to replace them? There will be a slate of candidates that people can choose from.

Rebeca: Now, Phil, pretty much every California governor in recent history has faced an attempted recall. Is this just par for the course in California or do you think based on your reporting that this will actually have teeth?

Phil: You're right. I think every governor for the past 50 years has faced recall. Gavin Newsom himself has faced six different, this is the sixth attempt to recall him. People were trying to recall him like the minute he got into office. This is unique though because there's only been one California governor who's been recalled in the history of the state. That was Gray Davis back in 2003 and that's when we were having rolling blackouts. That's when, after the dot com bust, we were slashing the state budget. He had raised the car tax, so a whole host of things led to his demise and that's when famously Arnold Schwarzenegger jumped in and was elected and served two terms as California's governor.

Rebeca: Gwynne, Governor Cuomo is clearly facing political backlash as we've been saying, but have these recent controversies changed how the public generally views him?

Gwynne: It still feels very early to weigh in on that. There was a polling that came out recently that showed a slight dip in popularity since controversy bubbled up about this nursing home situation, but still that's way higher than his approval was pre-pandemic times. It still feels very soon to try to see exactly how this is going to sway the larger public's opinion on somebody who's been governor for so long and has a deep political history in New York state.

Rebeca: Going back to his relationship with elected officials, there have been some recent tiffs, as you've mentioned, with other politicians in the state. Can you tell us what has happened between governor and elected officials and what the response has been?

Gwynne: Sure. The height of this has expanded out of a situation with one state assembly member named Ron Kim, who represents a district in Queens. He has been critical of how the governor has handled the situation specifically in nursing homes for the entire pandemic, the entire course of the pandemic. He now chairs the aging committee, this assembly man, but his own uncle died in Flushing, in a Flushing nursing home from COVID last spring. Assembly member Kim spoke to reporters, a New York Post reporter about a private conversation that Cuomo's top aides had with Democratic lawmakers. After that story ran that described at this private conversation, Kim came publicly out and said that he had received a threatening phone call from governor Cuomo, where he felt physically, like he was physically in danger. His wife was scared, he said.

Then the governor during a public press conference spent 21 minutes of it berating this assembly member. I think Cuomo's calculation was that people would side with him, but really it caused this bubbling up of all kinds of stories about times that reporters and political activists and many, many people receiving calls from either Cuomo directly or from his staff members that were bullying.

New York city Mayor Bill De Blasio came out in favor of Ron Kim and said many people in New York have gotten these phone calls and it was sort of this open secret that many people in politics were aware of, but hadn't really been reported on the record. There was some reporting around threatening phone calls during the last election cycle for political opponents, but it seems like that fear that had existed of publicly speaking against the governor dissipated with Ron Kim coming forward. In the wake of that, we've then seen these two women step forward and describe sexual harassment in his office.

Rebeca: Gwynne, with Governor Newsom, we're seeing this push to recall him. Are we seeing any of that here in New York?

Gwynne: That also feels very early. There are members-- I mean, the Republican party, yes, is calling for steps towards his impeachment or his resignation and there is a faction of the left, more progressive, younger lawmakers, who have been more willing to criticize the governor, also calling for that. Whether or not it passes into the more moderate centrist Democrats that are the majority control of both houses in the New York legislature, that

still remains to be seen.

Rebeca: We've been talking to Phil Willon. He's a staff writer for The LA Times covering Gavin Newsom and California politics, and Gwynne Hogan, a reporter for WNYC and Gothamist. Gwynne, Phil, thank you both for joining us.

Gwynne: Thanks Rebecca.

Phil: Thank you.

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Rebeca: Hey, we asked you out there what you thought about your governor and how they're doing, and you told us.

Speaker 4: My name's Crash and I live in Milwaukee, Wisconsin. I think the governor has done the best he can, all things considered. Our state assembly, like most Midwest states, has an urban rural divide that has a lot to do with race. We're overrun with Trumpian Republicans that have convinced the rural areas to vote against their best interests. They cut off our governors every effort at the knees with packed courts, 11th hour rule changes, endless lawsuits. He can't get anything done and they're just shameless in their obstructionism.

Greg: This is Greg in Tigard, Oregon. I am pleased with our governor's response to the pandemic. She has been at the forefront of an active response that has prevented the spread of the corona virus and saved lives.

Speaker 6: I'm really disappointed that Governor Brown prioritized a lower risk group of people, specifically educators, to be vaccinated before seniors and high risk individuals from the state. She turned a public health issue into a political opportunity by making that choice.

Denise: My name is Denise [unintelligible 00:19:27] I'm in Dallas, Texas. Abbott responded abysmally to the crisis in Texas, but Abbott has always failed to help the people of Texas. He is not a public servant. He is a self-serving politician and I might add, of the worst kind.

Rebeca: You can always hit us up. Record a voice memo on your phone and email it to takeawaycallers@gmail.com.

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