Brian Lehrer: We end today with a big treat. Patti Smith, the singer, songwriter, poet, artist, and author of books including Just Kids, M Train, and A Book of Days, in advance of her show tomorrow night at the McCarter Theater in Princeton, on the Princeton University campus, not too far from where Patti grew up in South Jersey. I'm seeing that on her current tour, Patti's performances include spoken word poems as well as music and stories from her life. Patti Smith joins us along with Paula Abreu, director of special events at the McCarter Theater Center. Paula, welcome. Patti, so great to have you on again. Welcome back to WNYC.

Paula Abreu: Thank you. Thank you so much.

Patti Smith: Thank you, so glad to be here. Thank you, Brian.

Brian Lehrer: Patti, I'm reading from a release that describes your current tour performance as a mix of music, spoken word poems and stories from your life. Can you give our listeners your take on the mix you're presenting on this tour and what it means to you?

Patti Smith: Actually, it's not very different than what I usually do. It's just on this particular one, this particular evening tomorrow, there are no drums but the poetry, stories, repartee with the people and music is always part of our performances. I like to stay in contact with the people and in contact with poetry.

Brian Lehrer: I understand you've brought a little something to read for us as a preview or a sample of what you're doing.

Patti Smith: I thought that I would because one of our themes, as we're touring, is gratitude and to be very grateful for what we have even in the midst of any kind of strife, because it's wonderful to be alive. I thought I would recite the lyrics to Grateful.

Brian Lehrer: Beautiful.

Patti Smith: Whenever you want me to do it.

Brian Lehrer: Oh, yes, go ahead.

Patti Smith: Oh, I'm sorry.

Ours is just another skin

That simply slips away

You can rise above it

It will shed easily

It all will come out fine

I've learned it line by line

Like a ship in a bottle

Held up to the sun

Sails ain't going nowhere

You can count every one

Until it crashes to the earth

And simply slips away

You can rise above it

It will shed easily

It all will come out fine

I've learned it line by line

Ours is just a craving

And a twist of the wrist

Will undo the stopper

With abrupt tenderness

Die little sparrow

And awake singing

It all will come out fine

I've learned it line by line

One common wire

One silver thread

All that you desire

Rolls on ahead

All that you desire

Rolls on ahead

Brian Lehrer: Beautiful. For someone like you, Patti, who is very in touch with injustices in the world and I also see that you are shouting some of those out from the stage on this tour, how do you stay in touch with gratitude?

Patti Smith: By waking up every day. Every day I wake up, I feel grateful.

Brian Lehrer: That's a start.

Patti Smith: I've lost so many friends and loved ones. I really am happy to be alive no matter what we have to face, to have another chance to make things right, another chance to create, another chance to see my children. Yes, I'm grateful every day.

Brian Lehrer: That's great. Paula Abreu from the McCarter Theater Center. I see this will be Patti's first performance in Princeton, though hardly her first in New Jersey. What does it mean to you and McCarter that she'll be performing there tomorrow night?

Paula Abreu: Oh, my God. It's a dream. First of all, I've always had incredible respect for her work and artistic integrity. To have Patti open this season, it's my first season of McCarter. It's just simply a dream. I'm pinching myself still.

Brian Lehrer: Patti, if I've got your bio right, you were born in Chicago, but raised mostly in South Jersey. Where more specifically did you grow up?

Patti Smith: I'm from Chicago, we went to Philadelphia and then when I was eight, to southern New Jersey in the Gloucester Township area of Woodbury Deptford. Really just about half an hour from Philadelphia and going down toward the shore. I was raised in a very rural area of South Jersey. It was a very magical experience, not in terms of culture, but in terms of life, in terms of music and in terms of nature.

Brian Lehrer: Again, if I've got your bio right, you went to Glassboro State Teachers College in Jersey. Glassboro is now Rowan University. Did you originally plan to become a teacher?

Patti Smith: I wasn't certain what I would do. I didn't have the income to go to art school and teachers' college. Luckily, it was very reasonable. It allowed me to get an education. I had thought about it because I liked working in front of people. I was never shy to speak or lecture or do my book reports in front of people. I thought maybe I could be a good teacher but some of those skills I learned, I use on the stage. They're all communication skills. Maybe one can offer a little to the people that come to the concerts.

Brian Lehrer: I think maybe you've still got some communication skills just a little bit. [laughter] I read a review of your show in DC the other day that said you're one of the baby boomers who never gave up the good fight, and you talked about and sang about some of the things in the news or enduring causes. Would you like to pick something of your choice that's on your mind these days, since this is largely a political show, and talk about it here?

Patti Smith: The most important thing to me is our environment, is climate change, which is a universal-- It's a global concern. It's a concern that all of our youth, all of our people can unite globally to do something about because it affects us all but it's the thing that I'm most concerned about what will happen to our species, what is happening to our land. Overbuilding, even I just heard a bit of your show. We're talking about development, more development in New York. Yes, we need houses, but let's be careful not to take every green space in our city and let's be careful how we do it. I just think that we have to become more in tune with nature and our environment, and that concerns me every day.

Brian Lehrer: Paula, what kind of audience do you think Patti can expect at the McCarter Theater Center on the Princeton campus tomorrow? A lot of current Princeton students or what kinds of mix?

Paula Abreu: Oh, I think it's going to be a great mix. McCarter has a unique role in the community because we're really the bridge between campus and the community. I think tomorrow we're going to have both, a mix of the community, a mix of students, scholars. Actually, Patti is giving a talk tomorrow at the university as well, in partnership with the Princeton University Humanities Council, which is really exciting. We love to have artists expand the connection with the community. She's going to give you a talk with a professor who teaches her work at the university and a PhD student. We're expecting a great crowd tomorrow.

Brian Lehrer: A professor who teaches her work. There's a course in Patti Smith?

[laughter]

Paula Abreu: I don't know if it's a course, but she teaches her work every semester. All students who come to Princeton University have a chance to learn about Patti.

Brian Lehrer: Patti, you want to say something about that?

Patti Smith: Yes. As a girl who went to teachers' college, that is such a huge honor. Also, I'm always so grateful and honored when young people are still responding to the work that we do and books and in our political concerns. That makes me really happy. Thank you.

Brian Lehrer: How much do you find different audiences, Patti, to be different, when you're on tour, is a Princeton audience? I realized you haven't played in Princeton before, but with Princeton, and what that tends to signify, different from a state university college crowd or Jersey crowd, different from a Midwest crowd or anything like that?

Patti Smith: People they're different everywhere. I play all over the world, but I try to stay in tune with that. I try to stay in tune with the age level, the energy level of the people, the history of the place that I'm playing at. Each one is a new adventure. Even if I'm singing similar songs, I try to customize each performance we do to the place that we're performing. I'm sure that there will be things in Princeton that I'll be tipping a hat to.

Brian Lehrer: What kind of music did you listen to growing up in South Jersey?

Patti Smith: Of course, R&B and early rock and roll. I love to dance. I loved rock and roll, but I listened a lot to Coltrane, Nina Simone, Joan Baez and eventually Bob Dylan, but Coltrane was very important to me, both musically and spiritually. Tomorrow is his birthday, so that's a nice coincidence.

Brian Lehrer: Indeed. I see you're planning a New York City performance for your birthday, December 30. You do that every year in Lower East Side, right?

Patti Smith: Yes, I'll be 77. Lenny Kaye will also be 77, and we'll be performing in Chicago on his birthday. It's a double birthday celebration this year.

Brian Lehrer: I'm seeing these tour dates, you did show us from DC to Portland, Oregon, already recently, tomorrow in Princeton, then you're going to multiple cities in Germany and to Belgium. I think I'm seeing Italy, you're so active. How much do you like or hate or tolerate life on tour?

Patti Smith: I try to make it affable. The things that I don't like is travel is getting more and more difficult, it's getting more expensive, but I like greeting the people. Because I'm playing with people that are old friends and my son, Jackson, is my guitar player in Europe. That takes the sting out of any inconveniences touring, to be able to look at my son on stage.

Brian Lehrer: Let me get a caller in here with you. Mills in Harlem is calling in. Mills, you're on WNYC with Patti Smith and Paula Abreu from the McCarter Center in Princeton. Hi, Mills.

Mills: Hi. I first discovered your music when I was an intern in France. The architect I was working for had a cassette tape, and I was like, "Wow, where has this been?" Then I read all your books and follow you. I would just want to hear you tell the youth today how to live their life freely because I feel like this generation of kids coming up right now is so scared of making mistakes. Anything that they do feel that radical, they're doing only in front of a screen.

Brian Lehrer: Tall order, Patti.

Patti Smith: Simply, I think, people have to be themselves, but also make room for other people. Just be compassionate, and in terms of here, we all make mistakes. We all make mistakes and that's how we grow. We all lose loved ones and that's how we evolve. Life is always going to throw us curveballs. Again, it's just grateful to be alive and not be afraid to be oneself. I think it's very important not to measure oneself according to what other people think, whether it's in social media or mentors, anyone. You have to measure yourself by your own good deeds, your own contributions, and when you make a mistake, just pick up and go again. That's what I've always done and I've survived. I'll be 77, and believe me, I've made plenty of mistakes.

Brian Lehrer: Pick up and go again. Well, pick up and go see Patti Smith at the McCarter Center in Princeton tomorrow, if you are so inclined. Paula Abreu from the McCarter Center, 10 seconds for any last plug you want to give us.

Paula Abreu: Thank you. I would love for people to check out our season. Unfortunately, the course is sold out tomorrow, but there's plenty of other shows they can come. Pink Martini, Vijay Iyer, so check out the lineup. Thank you so much for having me, Brian.

Brian Lehrer: Thank you both so much for joining us.

Patti Smith: Thank you. Thanks a lot.

Brian Lehrer: Patti, what a pleasure to speak to you again. Brian Lehrer on WNYC. Have a great weekend, everyone, and stay tuned for All Of It.

Copyright © 2023 New York Public Radio. All rights reserved. Visit our website terms of use at www.wnyc.org for further information.

New York Public Radio transcripts are created on a rush deadline, often by contractors. This text may not be in its final form and may be updated or revised in the future. Accuracy and availability may vary. The authoritative record of New York Public Radio’s programming is the audio record.