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Brigid Bergin: It's the Brian Lehrer Show on WNYC. Welcome back, everybody. I'm Brigid Bergin from the WNYC and Gothamist Newsroom filling in for Brian. As New York City Public Schools reopened for another school year during a pandemic, we wanted to talk about what it means for homeless families, with children in school. Remote learning during the lockdown, particular challenges for anyone without reliable access to WIFI or even cellular data services and that's on top of all the other problems that stem from poverty.

For this, we're joined by Christine Quinn, the former speaker of the City Council, who now heads the organization, Win, the homeless services for women and children. Will ask the former mayoral candidate also about New York's first female governor. Welcome back to the show, Christine Quinn.

Christine Quinn: Thanks for having me on, It's fun to be on with you.

Brigid Bergin: Listeners, we want to hear from you. If you're raising your kids without stable housing in a shelter or living with friends or family, how has the start of the school year been so far? Call us at 646-435-7280. That's 646-435-7280. Chris is the CEO of Win. Was remote learning so challenging for homeless families that actually going back to school buildings with access to meals and no device or data plan requirements to worry about actually just a big plus?

Christine Quinn: The remote learning for homeless families was terrible and it was terrible for a number of reasons. One, it was always going to be a challenge just because it's a different living setup. Two, none of the shelters really at the beginning of the pandemic, maybe very few had WIFI connection so that was another problem. Most significant the mayor promised he had 200,000 donated devices iPads, et cetera. He promised that the first of those would go to children in homeless shelters and children in the housing authority and that they would have a cellular package.

I think it was two weeks after school started and a New York Times cover story before Win got one device into one of our shelters. This great promise was made and then our families were forgotten. Now, beyond in addition to that, nobody recognized that homeless families, the adults in them are often working and we had about 250 essential workers who worked at Win. 92% of our families are headed by a single woman. We had to create a way ourselves, socially distance safe classrooms where we could teach the children of essential workers because most of them didn't have a parent who could stay home with them.

No one really thought about homeless children beyond a press release, as it relates to the pandemic. Now, the pandemic did force the mayor to put WIFI in shelters, so that's a good result, but it came about again because homeless children were forgotten. I think most of our parents, most of our moms at Win we're very happy this week when children could go back to a school building. Then after school come back to Win, where we have after-school programming. Again, it was not without problems and those problems come in my opinion from forgetting that homeless children go to  

our public schools.

Brigid Bergin: I can't get that image out of my mind that you just described of having to set up these classrooms in these shelters, just sort of ad-hoc all of a sudden because these kids were trying to do remote learning on their own, which certainly we know that the children of essential workers were faced with across the city. Now that they are starting school this year, going back into classrooms, are there particular challenges that these families are facing this year?

Christine Quinn: Well, we faced some around the first day or first couple of days now. One, buses. Yet again, we didn't have all of our buses show up at our shelters to take our kids to school and it's like Groundhog Day, the first day of school, as it relates to buses. Someday they'll get it right. That was one problem. The thing is listeners might be like, "Well, buses they're late." Something or they don't show up. Something like that is traumatizing to a homeless child whose whole life has been about being moved around, being told no. People in authority falling through, and not meeting their commitments, so it was a big impact.

Worse than that, we heard reports from families who went to school with this letter that Win has to produce that says that they live in a homeless shelter for a zoned school. It's a standard situation and we heard from a lot of parents that they were rejected and told, "No, you can't go to this school. You don't live here." Well, they do live there. They live in a shelter, but they live there. Of course, we intervened and it's all fixed, but it's a think of how much mom and the child must feel like everyone's looking at them.

Then you come in the second day of school and they're like, "Why did you miss the first day of school?" "Oh, because I live in a shelter." Then the bullying starts. Again, the Department of Education and the Department of Homeless Services know where all the homeless children are. Why don't we have on the first day of school, some extra staff trained in how to help homeless moms and children so we don't have these kinds of problems. No one wants to think about homeless children because they only see them as a problem and a group of children who are going to bring down the scores, not bring them up.

That's not true, but that's how they're seen.

Brigid Bergin: It's a really scathing assessment, but it sounds like a real gap that has been identified and probably could be addressed.

Christine Quinn: Easily. The City Council particularly the education chair, Mark Treyger, he fought for two or three years in a row and got social workers in schools that have high numbers of homeless kids and that's really helped. Initiatives like that should be expanded particularly around stressful times, like the first day of school.

Brigid Bergin: What about the devices that you mentioned that the department of education distributed for remote learning, did they have to be returned?

Christine Quinn: They did. They were collected, so a couple of things. One, if God forbid we have to go back to remote, then we're going to go through the whole

distribution process again, which is a big challenge. Two, why they couldn't assign them to Win and the other providers is a question I don't understand. I get in a way of like, well, the X family, they're going to leave shelter and then we may not get it back, but we could also collect them. There's ways to do it. The city and I've heard them say this, not about this, but about other things, they don't want families to be that comfortable.

They think we still have that Giuliani attitude of people are going to shelter because it's easy and comfy. If they have a device, if they have air conditioning, we had to fight for that then they're going to stay. That I believe is why the device has got taken back and I'm sure they're sitting in a box somewhere.

Brigid Bergin: We all know it's been a hotly debated issue, that there is no remote learning option for people who prefer it, but there are going to be instances where classrooms are shut down because of COVID. Are you saying, is there a remote learning plan for quarantine or is that something that is going to have to be figured out on the fly again?

Christine Quinn: Well, to some degree, it's going to have to be figured out on the fly. At Win, we have computer rooms in every shelter. We at least have those, if we say, have a classroom shut down for Delta or something like that, but that's a limited thing, not if the whole shelter is coming back remote.

Brigid Bergin: You talk about the gap that it's very clear in terms of what the DOE and Homeless Services don't do on, say, the first day of school, but are there services that are provided to homeless students beyond free meals?

Christine Quinn: Yes, we have in every one of our shelters a DOE, a Department of Education Liaison assigned to the building and they are usually enormously helpful. They're particularly helpful for new families who come to our shelter and may have to transfer schools, or get MetroCard. I do want to recognize that service from the Department of Education and say we should think about expanding it. As I mentioned before the bridging-the-gap social workers that the city council took the lead on are very, very, very helpful and the kind of model we should really expand.

Brigid Bergin: Is there other assistance besides first-day assistance that you think they should be providing to homeless families?

Christine Quinn: Well, I think they should expand the number of social workers in schools with high numbers of homeless children. There are simply not enough even with the Council's initiative. We have after-school programming at Win but not every shelter is able to have that depending on size and resources. It would be useful to have not separate after-school programming at schools for homeless children but after-school programming that recognizes that there are homeless children in the programming and does things that would be uplifting and helpful to homeless children.

We right now have a bill in the city council. It got heard yesterday that would require in the Department of Homeless Services, all DHS workers and contractors to be

trained in trauma-informed care, which is the best way to deal with homeless folks and homeless families. We could do a similar thing if we were able to expand the dedicated staff at the Department of Education for homeless children.

Brigid Bergin: I understand the DOE did mail pandemic food cards to all families to reimburse them for the days their children were home and not getting fed at school that was up to $1,320 regardless of income. Was that able to get to the families who might be moving around a lot and really address the need?

Christine Quinn: I've heard that there was a problem with people or families getting it. We did not have that problem reported with our Win families. People did receive it. More is better, but it's a decent chunk of money.

Brigid Bergin: I know you talked to Brian about the fact that when some people hear about homeless New Yorkers, they think about people living on the streets or in subways or parks and not the women and children who Win really serves.

Christine Quinn: Right.

Brigid Bergin: Can you talk about what the numbers are and who is living in New York City without homes and what those populations look like now?

Christine Quinn: Within the shelter system, depending on where we are at, it's anywhere from 65% to 70% of the people in shelter are families with children. There are more children in shelter than there are seats at the Barclays Stadium, just to give you a visual. Now, the focus of that reality, really, our system was built around a response to the homeless crisis for singles, which is still a crisis. The majority of homeless people are families and we don't really have a system that was structured around families.

It's interesting, what's one of the biggest problems for singles, significant mental health, right? We have mental health issues in our families, but we have other issues too. Issues around trauma for children, employment issues, moms wanting to get better jobs, et cetera. It's like we created a hospital and the one wing is for the singles except it doesn't have a psychiatric ward, it only has dermatology. The wing for the moms which needs pediatrics and job training, it doesn't have that. It only has plastic surgery.

We need to really be basically data-driven. What problems do some population have, and then structure it around that? You can't have New York City, you can't have conversations of we're coming back when that many children live in shelter. We're coming back to a bad place if we come back and still have that many children living in shelter. The biggest indicator of whether or not you're going to be a homeless adult is whether you were a homeless child. Which makes sense.

Brigid Bergin: Absolutely. Let's bring some of our callers into the conversation, Gwen in Harlem, Gwen welcome to WNYC.

Gwen: Hi, thank you. Hi, Christine. I live in East Harlem and you have been to our shelters with Jenny Clark, we have seven of them here. I have lived in East Harlem

for 40 years and run for city council so you might know me. One of the things, [chuckles] I also worked very hard to save PS 109, which was a clear miss for the homeless shelter here. One of the reasons why I worked to save PS109 and turn it back into a public school is the crappy, disgusting public schools we have mostly in East Harlem, at least since 1999.

A real miss was that 1,200 kids from these shelters could have been going to that school, which is beautiful, only one block from these buildings and we missed it. We decided to turn it into a fancy place for artists, which would have been great if we had extra space, but we didn't have extra school space. Today, the reason why I'm calling you is that inside Jenny Clarke homeless shelters, there's a beautiful backyard that has not been used for years. It's a gazebo in there.

I was speaking to an architect who says she plans to tear down the gazebo, which is really a miss for the community. because the community does not want to tear it down. On top of it, we have a cat colony that lives there and something strange out there.

Christine Quinn: I'm sorry, what colony?

Gwen: Everyone in the community-- [chuckles]

Brigid Bergin: I think she said a cat colony, I guess.

Gwen: You're not going to believe this. We have some very, very promiscuous cats up here and [crosstalk]

Brigid Bergin: Well, Gwen, can I jump in and bring you back to the conversation about homeless children in schools, so how does the cat colony at this shelter connect to the conversation about homeless children in the schools?

Gwen: How do people take care? No one takes care of it.

Christine Quinn: Let me jump in. Jenny Clarke is a Win shelter. It's actually five tenement buildings sitting on buildings strung together. There is a backyard. It's not huge but there is a backyard and a backyard definitely needs some fancying up, some zhuzhing up. There is not a gazebo. Maybe it's a different piece of property and there is not a cat colony there. If there are folks listening who want to help with the zhuzhing up the backyard, please reach out to Win on our website. We'd love to hear from landscape architects and others.

Regarding the gazebo and the cat colony, I'd suggest you reach out to the community board.

Brigid Bergin: I think her line dropped before, unfortunately, we got to her main point, which is ultimately, is there something communities can do to bridge the gap with shelters?

Christine Quinn: Oh, sure.

Brigid Bergin: What recommendations would you have there?

Christine Quinn: Well, we have and it's changed a little bit during the pandemic, but a very robust volunteer program at about 2,500 volunteers. Prior to the pandemic, we would have people come into the shelters and they might teach financial literacy. They might throw a party. We have a wonderful group of people who come in, actually to one of the other East Harlem shelters and do free yoga. We had the folks at Morgan Stanley do robotics with the kids. The sky is the limit on what you can do.

We have neighborhoods out in Queens who bring holiday gifts during the winter, Mother's Day gifts. We have salons that come at Mother's Day time, et cetera., to do nails and hair. We have a terrific volunteer department just reach out to Win on its website, which is winnyc.org, two Ns. We can get you very, very involved. We often do it through the community board but through churches, synagogues and mosques as well.

Brigid Bergin: It's great advice and Gwen, I'm sorry, we lost you but hopefully, that helps answer some of your question there. Let's go to Susie in Manhattan. Susie, welcome to WNYC.

Susie: Hi, thank you so much. I'm part of a group called Moms United for Black Lives. It is a Black-led group and because the Mayor and the DOE has failed students with technology, they give them laptops or more likely an iPad that has tracking software on them and they have to give them back. They often have problems. We started a GoFundMe over a year ago. This is an organization led by Tanesha Grant, a very powerful activist. We raise money through a GoFundMe and over the past year we have given away to Black and Brown students, many unhoused some perfectly housed brand new HP laptops that they get to keep.

Every time they're given a laptop, at one of these laptop giveaways at PC Richards on 125th Street, Tanesha Grant hands them the laptop and says, "You deserve this. You get to keep this. This is yours and you are powerful because you have it." After CBS did a quick piece on us a couple of months ago, HP reached out to us, and they are partnering with us. They have given us some laptops to give away. We're still working out what our relationship is going to be. This is what kids need. This is what unhoused kids need.

This is what Black and brown kids who don't have access to good technology needs. The DOE could be doing this, it would be more cost-effective to give away brand new laptops, never get them back if they don't do it for their own reasons.

Brigid Bergin: Susie--

Christine Quinn: Well, for me just say thank you. Thank you and everyone who's part of this effort. I know we would love to talk to you if you could. You or someone else reach out that would really be great. You've hit the nail on the head but again, I would love to talk to you about this.

Brigid Bergin: Susie, thanks so much for calling. I think one of the show's producers can get your information and share it with Christine Quinn and her organization some  

good tips there and a possible connection for some of the young people who are serviced by your shelter. I mentioned that I'd asked you about governor Kathy Hochul, the first woman to hold that office in this state amazingly. Let's start by talking about her first act as governor, with calling a special legislative session to extend the eviction moratorium in the state. How big a deal was that for preventing you from having more clients?

Christine Quinn: Well, look, let me first say I think it's thrilling that we have a woman governor in New York State, particularly since we've never had a woman mayor in New York City. I think Kathy is already doing a terrific job. I do think it's important for all of us to note that yet again, a man messed up and a woman has had to come in to fix that mess. That said, Kathy knew that if the eviction moratorium just expired, we would be left with tens of thousands of people who had a huge rent bill.

That most of them more than likely did not have the resources to pay and a system that was not ready for that many people "poof" all of a sudden. A significant portion would have ended up in shelter and a large proportion of those using the moratorium are families. If she hadn't taken the action she took followed by the legislature's action, we would have really seen the crisis we have in shelter been an overnight catastrophe, in my opinion.

Brigid Bergin: I just need to do a quick station ID. This is WNYC FM HD and AM New York WNJT Fm 88.1 Trenton, WNJP 88.5 Sussex, and WNJY 89.3 Netcong, and WNGO 90.3 Toms River. This is New York and New Jersey Public Radio. I'm speaking with Christine Quinn, CEO of Win the largest provider of family shelter and supportive housing in New York City, of course, the former City Council speaker and mayoral candidate. As you were talking, I think about some of the people who Governor Hochul has elevated into her administration.

Certainly her Chief Counsel, Catherine Fink, who held that position for you as speaker. Then also Kathryn Garcia is Director of State Operations and other women she's appointed to positions in the governor's office. We've talked a little bit about what her policy priorities have been. What does this tell you about her leadership?

Christine Quinn: Well, I think Kathy, is a very participatory leader, a very inclusive leader, and the fact that her secretary, which is the highest-ranking position is a woman her counsel is Fine, who had been my general counsel is a woman. Her lieutenant governor is an African American man. I think she really wants to send a message that her government is diverse and inclusive and reflective of New York State. It's often said that if you can't see it, you don't know that you can be it.

Now not only do girls know they can be the governor, African American children know they can be lieutenant governor, the second-highest-ranking person in the state. I also think how diverse her government is already. Really a race is what you hear, "Well, we tried to find someone who was a woman, we tried to find a Latinx person, we tried to find an African American person, but we couldn't find any," which, implies there aren't any smart or good people of those characteristics, which is just not true. We know that and Kathy has already proved that.

Brigid Bergin: I said, I misstated the name of your former counsel. It's obviously Elizabeth Fine, not Elizabeth Fink too many Albany reporters in my brain right now. I apologize.

Christine Quinn: No worries.

Brigid Bergin: Thank you for catching that for me so I could make that clarification. Before we let you go, I want to talk just for a moment about some federal issues. The details of the big reconciliation bill in the Congress are still being hashed out but could what's in the bill make a big difference for New York, especially the families your organization serves?

Christine Quinn: Absolutely. There's potentially 37 billion for a Housing Trust Fund, 90 billion for rental assistance, 80 billion for public housing, our New York City Housing Authority. Those are game-changer type of numbers. They're not small numbers. We're very, very lucky to have Chuck Schumer at the helm of this negotiation because obviously, he's keeping national interests in mind, but he's also keeping urban America very much at the top of his mind and New York.

These buckets of money will make a big difference for New York but for cities across the country, and Chuck really understands that in a way that a different senator might not so we're very, very lucky. We have been working with the national coalitions to keep pressure on down in Washington. I want to thank Nancy Pelosi, but we have our fingers crossed so to speak, that things will work out because it can make a difference.

Brigid Bergin: Well, we're going to have to leave it there. Thank you, Christine Quinn, President, and CEO of Win the largest provider of family shelter and supportive housing in New York City. It was great to have you back on WNYC.

Christine Quinn: Take care. Thank you.

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