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Brian Lehrer: Brian Lehrer on WNYC. We're continuing to meet the people who are running for mayor of New York. I know you're still burnt out on this year's election, but the mayoral primary will come up pretty fast in 2021. It's just six months away in June. There are all these interesting people now introducing themselves to the public as candidates in addition to the names you already know. One of those interesting new people is my next guest Dianne Morales, former CEO of several multi-million dollar nonprofit social service providers.

Her story, according to her website, begins with being born in Bed-Stuy, Brooklyn to two working class Puerto Rican parents, and growing up to get graduate degrees at Harvard and Columbia. It says she has a deep understanding of our city's dysfunctional education, justice and healthcare systems. We'll take it from there on her candidacy in general and her take on some of the news in New York City today, in conversation with Dianne Morales. Miss Morales, thanks for coming on. Welcome to WNYC.

Dianne Morales: Good morning, Brian. Thanks so much for having me. I'm a big fan. It's a pleasure to be here.

Brian: Thank you. Would you like to start by introducing yourself a little more to our listeners? Like, how did your road lead from your working class childhood in Bed-Stuy to Harvard and Columbia graduate degrees?

Dianne: [chuckles] Sure, sure. As you already mentioned, I am a first generation Puerto Rican. I was born and raised in Bed-Stuy to a working class family. Also I am the single mother of two children with learning differences, one of whom struggles with mental health challenges, and the other who's been racially profiled and assaulted by the NYPD. I've lived the inequities in education, the health, the mental health systems, policing, and even gender as I've struggled to balance my role as the head of household, holding down a job while I could provide for my family.

I believe these experiences have made me a more effective executive and leader as I've dedicated my life to helping others navigate those challenges. I have successfully created education programs that counter equity issues in our schools by developing a program that was replicated citywide across every publicly funded after-school program in New York. I've co-founded a national organization that strengthens early literacy and preschool students, while providing teacher training to college students that now operates in 14 states across the country and has just celebrated its 26-year anniversary.

I've launched a career training program in healthcare by building cross-sector partnerships with private employers, higher education and my previous community-based organization that has exceeded national retention rates. I got into this race because I believe that combination of my lived and professional experiences has actually never been reflected in the city's leadership. A year ago, I thought that that would be an important factor in moving the city towards just better representation of historically marginalized communities that would ultimately benefit everyone.

Now, after living through the intersection of the COVID pandemic, with a racial pandemic, and the economic pandemic that preceded it, it feels more like a moral imperative for us to fundamentally shift how we operate, and how we lead New York City moving forward. I think it's high time for us to honor the essential front-line workers who continue to make it possible for the city to operate and for so many of us to work from home. I think that we do that by recognizing our collective interdependence and orienting our policies towards prioritizing their ability to live in dignity and provide for their families, and that ultimately, we will all benefit from that.

Brian: What does that mean in policy terms, for example, to honor essential workers in the ways that you say? Because, of course, we all know so many essential workers who will say, "Don't applaud and cheer and play musical instruments for me at seven o'clock, give me hazard duty pay-"-

Dianne: That's right.

Brian: -or things like that. Do you have some signature proposals, like de Blasio ran on universal Pre-K and a paid sick leave law in 2013, and those signature proposals got him really far.

Dianne: Yes. I think the core of my platform is the idea of really centering and elevating the voices of those that have been historically marginalized and underrepresented. I think we really need to fundamentally transform the orientation of how we create policy and how we prioritize who those policies impact moving forward. That includes things like universal basic income for people who need it, healthcare, housing for all, these are all- I think these are all really bold and radically different approaches.

I actually think that's also what we need at this moment in time, because I think one of the things that's become crystal clear is that the old ways of operating actually don't work and have made it possible for us to hit rock bottom, where we are right now, where there's a disproportionate impact on people from communities of color, whether you're talking from a healthcare perspective, or from an economic perspective, or just a general insecurity perspective. Yet, those are the very people who make it possible for the city to run. It feels to me like there is a unique and unprecedented moment for us to redefine how we move forward in a way that takes care of all of us.

Brian: You said universal basic income and housing for all.

Dianne: Yes.

Brian: Can you do that on a municipal level? Does the city have enough money? Certainly now, with the COVID caused fiscal crisis, but even in normal times, does the city have enough money to provide a universal basic income to every citizen beyond the programs that already exist? Of course, every mayor struggles to solve the housing problem, the affordable housing problem, the homelessness problem, which only seems to get bigger with each administration, and they struggle to do it in a way that doesn't break the city's bank.

How do you provide homeless for all or a universal basic income at the municipal level and have it be affordable?

Dianne: Sure. I guess the first thing I'll say that in response to that is, I always find this question really interesting, because when we start talking about prioritizing the needs of the neediest New Yorkers, the question or the neediest citizens of this country, to be honest, the question is always, how are you going to pay for it? When you're talking about food, or water, or housing, or healthcare, education, the question is always, how are you going to pay for it? The reverse is not true necessarily, when we're talking about providing corporate bailouts, or militarizing our police departments, or providing overtime and covering overtime for folks who are causing harm to our communities.

I would say that I think it's really important for us to start with what we do have control over. The reality of it is that the New York City budget has not prioritized or reflected a set of values that prioritizes addressing the needs of those who are most marginalized and low income. I would first want to take a hard look at some of the bloating, at some of the overspending, at some of the lines in our city budget that sit vacant but get reserved for- whether it's a city agency or whatever, that are just sitting there vacant for years. I've also talked about reducing the NYPD budget. I was the first mayoral candidate to call for divesting and reinvesting.

I think those- that's one of the places where we start. I'm also really excited about the newly elected super majority at the state level and hoping that those folks will partner with New York City in recognizing that where New York City goes, so too goes New York State, and that if we're not centering and really taking care of folks in New York City, it's going to signal a problem for the entire state.

Brian: You just talked about moving some money out of the police budget, I saw in Politico, New York that, confirm this or refute it that you do embrace the term "defund the police." Accurate?

Dianne: Yes, that is accurate, actually. I think that that reflects the reality of our need to significantly decrease the NYPD budget and reallocate and reinvest those dollars in the communities that need services. I think it reflects the idea that we need to redefine public safety, that for too long public safety and policing have been equated, but the reality of it is that in communities that are overpoliced, the residents of those communities do not necessarily feel safer as a result of an increased police presence.

I also think it's interesting, because for a very long time we've been defunding housing and education, and there hasn't nearly been the same uproar or reaction to the idea that that has been happening. Yes, I think it is really important for us to confront that reality that we need to significantly decrease the funding of the NYPD and provide services and programming in communities that need it most, that really, ultimately, most directly link to public safety.

Brian: Do you have a number on that, of the roughly $6 billion that I see reported as the NYPD budget, which is out of the city budget of, I think, about $90 billion? How much of that would you remove, and what would you actually remove the police from? The thing that always gets mentioned is in response to mental health crises that people are in.

Dianne: Sure.

Brian: Can you go beyond that?

Dianne: Yes. I called for the creation of what we're calling a "Community First Responders Department" I should say that I recognize that the majority of the calls that the police respond to are actually not in fact crimes, and they're not situations that the NYPD is actually trained to respond to. The Community First Responders Department will be staffed by professionals who are trained and skilled in interventions like medical staff for- we're talking about homeless situations, we're talking about mental health situations, we're talking about issues of substance abuse.

The Community First Responders team would actually be staffed by people who are qualified to intervene in those situations, which would not only save lives, but would ultimately help to connect to those people, to the services that they need, so that we are actually stopping the tide of recidivism that so often happens when people in these encounters are not, do not wind up dead, when they end up without their needs being met. This would actually work towards addressing that as well.

I also think we need to- the other thing I've called for is removing police from schools as the parents of two former public school students- I can attest to the idea that neither they nor I felt safe as a result of that. Those folks could somewhat more easily be deployed to support other functions related to the Community First Responders Department.

Brian: Close the loop on how that comes around to giving you money for housing for all, as you put it. Is it a voucher system for everybody? Is it more construction of public housing? How do you get the housing for all?

Dianne: Yes. I think the first thing is that we have to recognize that the current housing crisis that we're dealing with actually started long before the COVID pandemic and that the COVID pandemic has just exacerbated it and made it worse, made it more critical. I think it's important for us to provide immediate relief for folks right now. We can't, on the one hand, strongly suggest that people stay home, but at the same time, not allow or not provide for their ability to meet their own basic human needs. I think it's important for us to focus first on addressing the pandemic-induced crisis.

Then I think there are things that we need to think about and look at, whether that's the preponderance of luxury vacant apartments that exist across the city and how some of those might be repurposed, the existing and increasing commercial vacant spaces, and how those could be also repurposed for the purposes of providing housing. Ultimately, those are immediate solutions to a crisis that has pre-existed and that is basically attributable to some larger systemic and structural issues.

The idea that the housing market is profit-driven and focused on developers and tax incentives and subsidies for developers is problematic. We should really be moving towards a system that enables us to provide affordable housing to all through a community-based planning process, that centers community residents, and increases their opportunity also to access ownership where possible. It's just a fundamental reframing and shifting of the paradigm that has driven how we provide housing in New York City.

Brian: My guest, if you're just joining us for just another few minutes, is Dianne Morales who is now running for mayor in New York City. She is a former CEO of several nonprofit social service organizations, nonprofits with budgets in the millions, and now she's running for mayor. Before you go, let me touch on at least one of the issues in the mayoral election itself now, and that is how the election itself will be run.

New Yorkers, and listeners, for those of you who don't know this yet, passed a referendum to begin rank choice voting, which means, some of our listeners may not know, that instead of just voting for one candidate for mayor, people will rank their choices. If nobody gets a majority, then there's a formula for eliminating the bottom candidate and distributing that person's votes to each voter's second choice. Then the next bottom candidate is eliminated and their voter's next choice gets their vote, and so on until someone has 50% plus 1.

Some members of City Council want to delay rank choice voting on the argument that the public isn't being educated on it quickly enough, and that's going to disadvantage voters of color, they say. What's your position on rank choice voting and whether it should be delayed?

Dianne: Brian, my position on that is that it was overwhelmingly voted on by New York residents in 2019 and that the focus of the City Council, right now, and the city leadership needs to be on providing voters with the education that they need in order to exercise their rights. This is something that people have already raised their hand in favor of. The idea of backpedaling from that mandate is highly problematic. I think the city needs to focus on doing everything that they can and engaging other stakeholders in this process of educating people so that they understand what the options are, that are available to them, and can continue to exercise that right in a democratic process.

Brian: You want to make a closing statement? You've been introducing yourself to a lot of people who've never heard you before just now. What do you want to say going out this door and on the way to the rest of your campaign?

Dianne: Sure. Yes. I'd like to say that I am running a people-powered grassroots campaign that is reflective of average New Yorkers who may not have always felt like city leadership represented them or impacted them. My team is one that is reflective of the city. No one on my team is earning six figures. We are all working really, really hard to elevate the voices of people who just have not been part of this process.

I would encourage anybody who is interested in learning more or getting involved in the campaign to check out our website at dianne.nyc, and also to recognize that because this is a grassroots people-powered campaign, we are working on the support and the donations and contributions of New Yorkers.

Our average donation size is about $60, and that is reflective much more of the average New Yorker than I would argue any other candidate in this race. If folks want to get involved and support, please check out our website. Thank you, Brian.

Brian: Thank you very much for coming on today. As I'm saying to all the candidates, good luck out there, and we'll have you back in 2021.

Dianne: Thank you so much. Have a great day.

Brian: Listeners, we will continue to interview the various people, approximately one a week, until we've gone through all the meaningful ones, people who are jumping into the mayoral race, there are going to be a lot of them. With the first round, the primary coming up in June, it's going to come up quicker than you think and quicker than in past mayoral races. The New York City primaries used to be in September. Now, under a change in the law, pretty recently, they're in June, just like New York's presidential primary was this year.

The mayoral primary and for other city offices coming up in June of 2021, it's actually not that far away. We'll continue to introduce you to the new candidates in this really big field. Remember how there were 23 candidates for the Democratic presidential nomination? I don't think it's going to be 23, but it's big and we'll keep introducing you to some of the new faces and voices, like that of Dianne Morales, and some of the established candidates as well, before this really begins in earnest toward the second quarter of next year.

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