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Brigid Bergin: It's The Brian Lehrer Show on WNYC. I'm Brigid Bergin in for Brian today. Now we're going to wrap up today's show with a look at an American phenomenon, the death of the teen babysitter. When I say this, I'm not referring to an 80-slasher movie where a teenage babysitter becomes the unlucky first victim of a crazed serial killer. Instead, I'm talking about the disappearance of older kids, watching younger kids while parents go out on a date night or work the late shift.

According to Faith Hill from The Atlantic, Americans are no longer relying on the teenage girl next door for babysitting duties, but once was a, "quintessentially American experience", isn't an option for kids nowadays. With the disappearance of the teen babysitter, or also saying goodbye to a cultural icon from a bygone American era. Listeners, does your teenage daughter or son have a babysitting gig? Do you hire a teenager to watch your kids? Have you ever looked for a teen babysitter and just had no luck?

If you're hesitant about having the high schooler watch your kids, why is that the case? Or have you had a high schooler watch your kids and prefer them not to babysit them? Those of you who grew up babysitting as a teenager, what did that role mean to you? How do you look back on your time as a babysitter now that you're an adult? Give us a call at 212-433-WNYC. That's 212-433-9692. You can also text at that number.

As the calls come in, staff writer Faith Hill joins me now to talk more about her piece in The Atlantic, Don't Tell America the Babysitter's Dead. Faith, the piece starts off by declaring babysitting, a job that used to be both a job and a rite of passage for teen girls offering, "a tentative step toward adulthood responsibility, but with guardrails." Start us off there. How did babysitting allow teen girls in the United States to practice adulthood in their youth?

Faith Hill: Yes, I think it was a starter job for a lot of teens and even tweens. I think a lot of parents understood that the teen watching their kids was responsible enough to be doing this job, but they were still childlike and that was part of the deal. A lot of people told me that when they were babysitting at pretty young ages 12 or 13, they might get there and the kids were already asleep and they were there to just be an extra eye or there'd be leftovers there for them to heat up. There were these ways that parents would make sure that it was doable for the teen, and it was still a really important responsibility and an opportunity for growth, but it was understood that the teen was a teen.

Brigid Bergin: You write about the ways the teen babysitter has been depicted in pop culture time and time again throughout the 20th century. Can you take us through the many babysitter tropes we've seen in books, Stevie movies, and the societal tensions we were trying to work out through those tropes?

Faith Hill: Absolutely. I think when teen babysitting first got popular, parents felt uneasy about it. You had this young person who was on the cusp of adulthood, but clearly not so grown and responsible. There was this cultural anxiety both about that and about the gender element. These were often teen girls and there were these larger societal changes happening through the 20th century where girls were getting more autonomy and here they were working outside of the house.

They were there often because the moms were also getting more freedom going out to enjoy themselves at night. There was a lot of cultural worry. We can see that for example, in the 1960s there were a lot of depictions of babysitters being these temptresses that would seduce the father when the mom wasn't there like what happens when mom's not home.

Going into the '70s and '80s, there were a lot of horror films where the babysitter was trapped with a killer in the house and they had to protect the kids. There's a historian named Miriam Forman-Brunell, who has written about that and she believes it was a symbolic punishment for what people saw as the babysitter's irresponsible behavior. People were very nervous about what was going on when they weren't there.

Brigid Bergin: Poor teens. I want to go to some of our listeners who have experienced babysitting, have experienced getting babysitters. We're going to start with Jennifer in Brooklyn. Jennifer, thanks for calling WNYC.

Jennifer: Hi. I grew up and I started babysitting when I was only in about sixth grade which was pretty normal at the time. I was about 11 years old and I was entrusted with a five-year-old and a two-year-old regularly. Then I also had a six-month-old that I babysat. I made my own money. I walked home if it was too dark, maybe they would drive me home. Now I'm a mom of a daughter and she usually has her grandparents take care of her, but I also am a private music teacher.

I have hired my students over the years for tutoring and for babysitting. My daughter loves it when she has someone who's a teenager come over and they each have such distinct personalities and they get to know each other. It's been wonderful. Also, I didn't say this when I called in, but you brought up another point.

I did have a creeper experience myself with a father when I was a teenager. It was all fine when I was little, but one of the families I babysat for, I got a ride home from the dad, and then it was an awkward moment, nothing happened, but I was thinking about that trope and how it can be reversed also.

Brigid Bergin: Sure. Jennifer, can I just ask you, when you were doing your early babysitting, I think you said you were in sixth grade. How old were you?

Jennifer: I was about 11 when I started. First, it was mostly the afternoons, but it was going to the evenings for date nights. I loved it because I would raid the pantry and watch TV and do all the things I couldn't really do at my own house. I felt very grown up besides making the money, it was fun making frozen pizza for the kids. I thought it was a great way to get a sense of maturity. I think there should be more of it happening. I do manage to get some of my kids to babysit my students, but they're also really overscheduled and most of them don't really need the money that much.

Brigid Bergin: Sure. Jennifer, thank you so much for that call. Let's go to John in Woodhaven, Queens. John, thanks for calling WNYC.

John: Oh, hey. Hello.

Brigid Bergin: Hi, how are you?

John: Can you hear me?

Brigid Bergin: I hear you. I understand you used to be a babysitter.

John: Yes, I grew up in rural Connecticut and I babysat for a lot of neighbor's children. I made money as a young kid in middle school. Yes, as the last caller said, I felt super proud and responsible and I loved the job.

Brigid Bergin: John, thanks so much for that call. Faith, a couple of people remembering their experiences, babysitting, talking about getting babysitters. Now in your article, you described the 1920s as boom times for leisure, which resulted in boom times for teen babysitters. How did the leisurely times of the 1920s compare to the 2020s where it seems like teen babysitters in some cases are harder to find and in some places maybe don't even exist?

Faith Hill: Yes, a lot has changed, and yet the 1920s really were boom times for leisure. A lot of changes were happening. Car ownership was growing and people were going out to movies and restaurants more. It was an exciting time for adults and it created a lot of need for babysitters. These changes also affected people's parents.

It meant that grandparents were less available a lot of the time to watch the kids as they would've maybe in the past. Yes, now today, I think a lot of people still depend on family and friends, but the teen babysitter that developed in that time is just not so much trusted. We just see teens as younger. A lot of people don't even want 12-year-olds to be left alone at home anymore. I think there's a lot of reasons that we just see that age differently.

Brigid Bergin: The caller, Jennifer, raised the issue that part of the challenge in finding babysitters is some of these kids maybe don't need the money. Perhaps maybe are there more middle-class families where parents are just paying for everything. I'm not sure if that fits under the rising trend of intensive parenting, but I'm wondering what your thoughts are and your reaction is to that idea that perhaps some of the reason we aren't seeing this is because the kids aren't looking for it either.

Faith Hill: I think that's a big reason. I think a lot of teens are in extracurricular activities themselves, so it's part of the trend on one hand because younger kids are often in scheduled activities with adults, but that affects the teens too. There's been a shift, teen labor participation has been dropping in general for quite a while. We call it extended adulthood sometimes where the focus for a lot of teens is now on academics, getting into college.

There's this longer period before the kinds of responsibility that we used to associate with being an adult. People get married and buy houses later and all of that. Yes, there's this long period now where teens are busy focusing on academics and career exploration, and often have really packed schedules themselves. It's very structured and there's all these things they're doing to try to get a leg up in this world of intensive parenting.

Brigid Bergin: I want to bring in some of our callers. Let's try Erin on the Upper West Side. Erin, thanks so much for calling.

Erin: Yes, hi. What a wonderful program. I grew up babysitting and I guess doing as a mother helper, which is when the parents are still home, I think from the age of 10. I started out that way, but I think by 12 in sixth grade, I was babysitting up to four kids at once, and sometimes the parents would be out till 2:00 AM. I find it funny on the Facebook mom groups today where it's like, "I can't have a 16-year-old watch my 10-year-old."

It just seems a little funny because when I was growing up, I guess in the early 90s that wasn't the case at all. I think it was a huge development. Also, [unintelligible 00:11:46], The Baby-Sitters Club series came out. I think that bolstered how important it was for girls of my generation as is part of independence and growing up.

That was, I think, hugely formative for me making my own money, having my own independent time, becoming a parent handling conflict. My daughter is now 20, she grew up in New York and it wasn't cool to be a babysitter. It was like, "Ew, that's not a real job." Then after working at a coffee shop, she realized, "Oh, maybe it is." It's kind of super lucrative and kids are cool, so I think it's interesting how the fundamentals of what it teaches are still the same.

Brigid Bergin: Right. I want to thank Erin for joining us. Faith, I just want to give you about 15 seconds to respond to that before we have to wrap up a lot in that call.

Faith Hill: Yes, absolutely. I'm glad that you mentioned The Baby-Sitters Club because it came in a really interesting time in the '80s when this tug of war was going on about whether we trust teens and how you should feel about having your teen babysitter home without you. The Baby-Sitters Club books were a response to that. As you were saying, it was a portrayal of really competent mature teen girls.

Brigid Bergin: Well, we are going to leave it there. I'm so sorry Faith. My guest was Faith Hill, staff writer from The Atlantic. I'm Brigid Bergin, and this is The Brian Lehrer Show on WNYC. Thank you so much for listening. Tune in again tomorrow.

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