[music]

Kousha Navidar: This is All Of It. I'm Kousha Navidar, filling in for Alison Stewart. A few months ago, I had the great pleasure of speaking with singer-songwriter pianist Regina Spektor. She is someone whose work entered my life at the exact right moment. When I was in college, I was learning to play piano, and one of my closest friends said, "You've got to listen to Regina Spektor," so I listened to a CD, and the voice I heard and the piano that played told such vivid stories about joy, about regret. I remember thinking, "Dang, a piano can do that?"

Since then, she's performed at the White House, written memorable themes for TV and movies, and released multiple albums. It was my great joy when she came into the WNYC studios to show us just what a piano and voice can do together. Because we can all use a little more music in our lives, we're excited to re-air that conversation today. It began when she sat down at the piano and played a song called Becoming All Alone. Let's listen.

[MUSIC - Regina Spektor: Becoming All Alone]

I went walking home alone

Past all the bars and corner delis

When I heard God call out my name

And he said, "Hey

Let's grab a beer

It's awful late

We both right here"

And we didn't even have to pay

'Cause God is God

And he's revered

And I said:

"Why doesn't it get better with time?"

I'm becoming all alone again

Stay, stay, stay

Let the ones who want it bad

Get all the things that make them better

Let the ones who don't care feel a thrill

And I just want to ride

But this whole world

It makes me carsick

Stop the meter, sir

You have a heart

Why don't you use it?

Why doesn't it get better with time?

I'm becoming all alone again

Stay, stay, stay

Woo-ooh, woo-ooh

Woo-ooh, woo-ooh

Woo-ooh, woo-ooh

Woo-ooh, woo-ooh

Aaa-aah, aa--aah

Aaa-aah, aa--aah

Aaa-aah

I went walking home alone

Past all the bars and corner delis

When I asked God

Please call

Call my name

And I said, "Hey

Let's grab a beer

It's awful late

I know you're here

And we wouldn't even have to pay

'Cause You are God and You're revered"

Why doesn't it get better with time?

I'm becoming all alone again

Stay, stay, stay

I'm becoming all alone again

Stay, stay, stay

Stay, stay, stay

Stay, stay, stay

Stay, stay, stay

Kousha Navidar: Wow. Thank you so much. That was beautiful. One thing that I noticed, I'm just sitting here watching, listeners, I'm about, what, I'd say 20 feet away on the piano watching you, one thing that I see while you play is that you're choosing a register in the piano for a given time in the song, and you really get into that lower register of the piano towards the end of it, is that what you already have the foundation there, and you're really just putting that base home? What buck goes into there?

Regina Spektor: I think that what happened was, when I first started writing songs, I heard so many things in my head, and I was so worried about not being able to grow things or make them small, I cared so much about dynamics, that I really would just write different parts of songs in different places so that it could have somewhere to go, it could travel around. I don't think I do it consciously, but in hindsight, I realized that I was just holding place because I didn't have a bass and I didn't have a cello, and I didn't have high strings, so a lot of the time, the piano had to imply everything. Between the piano and my voice, I tried to stretch it as far as I could [chuckles] with implying things.

Kousha Navidar: Isn't that cool how the constraint leads to that creation, which is such a well-known fact [chuckles] for anyone who creates anything? You want to make something good, put constraints on it, right?

Regina Spektor: It's true, actually. I think that the limits do help you only if you buck against them, though, because if you're just staying within the limits, and you're just always stuck there, then it doesn't help.

Kousha Navidar: How do you buck against them?

Regina Spektor: Well, for me, it was really like, "Okay, well, I just wrote a song and it has arpeggios, and it has all this watercolory pedal on it, so the next song I'm going to write is going to be like really staccato, and really aggressive. This one has complicated chords and this one's going to be three chords, or this one's going to be just the voice." I also tried as much as I could to stretch my voice into doing things and making sounds and just to try and shapeshift as much as they could, even though I was just playing a piano, which is, it's interesting because it is a percussion instrument, but it's so vast and it really can be so many different things that I think I got very lucky that if you are going to get stuck with one instrument, getting a piano is really fun. [chuckles]

Kousha Navidar: Yes. Much love to the tuba players, though. They do what they can with what they got.

Regina Spektor: They do. As a matter of fact, I've had really amazing tuba. I've had the pleasure of having amazing tuba on a lot of my records and songs, and what they brought to the song, nothing else could bring.

Kousha Navidar: Absolutely. If you're just joining us, welcome. Thank you. We are WNYC All Of It. I'm Kousha Navidar, and I'm here with Regina Spektor, singer-songwriter. Her latest album Home, Before and After. You're celebrating, I guess in air quotes, "some amazing milestones". OG fans are celebrating them with you. It's been 10 years since your song from Orange Is the New Black and about 20 years since you first released your breakout album, Soviet Kitsch. Question for you about all have those milestones, are there big lessons you feel like you've carried from one project to the next, or is every project just like fresh start? What are we looking at to do this time?

Regina Spektor: I try really, really hard to have a fresh mind because I do think that as we do a lot of things, the field becomes narrower and narrower because we naturally want to, as people, be comfortable and with the familiar. I think there's a reason why people who get to a certain age, they're checking out the new bands. That happens with all kinds of things. People just realize that they think they know everything, they're arbiters of their tastes, and they get a little condescending.

[laughter]

I do think that, if you have the energy and if you have the curiosity, I think it's very worthwhile to keep that beginner's mind alive and to make yourself slightly uncomfortable, even if it is something as simple as, "Oh, I'm going to go to this part of town that I've never been to and I'm going to just walk into a restaurant of the kind of food I've never eaten," because something happens when you travel, when you eat, when you listen, when you do things that are outside of the norm for you.

I think when you make art, it's your job. You have to stay very, very open, but I think that even just, if you don't make art, just as a human wanting to have a really good life experience, it really pushes you. I really try very hard to do that consciously, even though it's not always easy, because when you have made a lot of records, you tend to sometimes also fall into those well-worn grooves and everything.

That's why when I made Home, Before and After, the world, because of the pandemic, sort of forced me into this new way of working. I'd never worked remotely with anybody. It was just a very different experience because I'm so used to being so hands-on. I have to say that even though it was really hard, I learned a lot just by doing things in a new way.

Kousha Navidar: I want to think about doing things in a new way, but also based on your roots, which I think is an interesting intersection there. Something you and I actually share in common is that we're both immigrants who moved to New York City around the same time and because of tough circumstances in our home countries. You're from Moscow originally, right?

Regina Spektor: Yes.

Kousha Navidar: I'm from Tehran originally. About a year ago, I read in this music blog with Stereogum that you were talking about your music lineage. I'll recap so you don't have to go back to the archives.

Regina Spektor: He just sees me squinting at him.

[laughter]

Kousha Navidar: Yes, right. Here's what you said that really struck me. You said one huge part of you that you don't get to share much with your American friends is the Russian singer-songwriters that you grew up with. You said it's a huge part of you and you love them because they made up songs about the craziest things. I got to say that, forgive the pun, that struck a chord with me because it's like, what do you get to share? What do you not get to share? Also, where do you reflect on the artistic roots of where you're from? I wanted to jam on your roots a little. Is there a Russian singer-songwriter you grew up with that I should be listening to, and what do they write about?

Regina Spektor: Oh my God. Well, there are so many. It's one of those things that when I saw The Matrix, I was like, "Oh, if I could just, instead of downloading how to have incredible martial arts skills, if I could download into all of my American friends, just the program that would allow them to partake in all these incredible Soviet-era singer-songwriters." Because basically, there was the official music, and all of these other people, they were just making these cassette tapes. They were house concerts. They were camping get-togethers, and they would write the most amazing songs, usually accompanied by guitar.

They were all self-taught, but it was because in Russia, basically, poets were heroes. It really had such a love of poets, and the poetry of these songs was on such an incredible level. I would say that, of my sou-soul, if I could somehow-- and I don't even know how you would translate a lot of it, it's so particular. There's this amazing, brilliant singer-songwriter named Vladimir Vysotsky, and he was a great actor of the stage. He wrote hundreds and hundreds of songs, really on all kinds of topics.

The amazing thing that he did was he embodied the characters. He would have everything from the deepest, most emotional songs about World War II, where even veterans would write to him. He was just the little boy during World War II, but veterans would write and they would say, "I remember that. I was in your platoon. I remember that moment." It was that vivid, and that's incredible.

Then he would also write these hilarious songs from the point of view of petty criminals or just all kinds of people. The thing that really influenced me was he would embody really bad people. He was an anti-hero in a lot of them. It was really incredible. I really internalized that idea of, I always wanted to have all these different perspectives and to be these different characters in my songs because I just loved so much listening to those stories.

Kousha Navidar: You feel like that's where your storytelling bug came from, or that inspiration of how you tell a story through music?

Regina Spektor: It was definitely a big part of it. I think also just, I had an insatiable hunger for stories. Just ever since I was little. If you wanted me to just pay attention to you, all you had to be like, "Once upon a time." I sit down and just be like, "Yes, uh-huh, and tell me more." As soon as one story would be over, I would just have this pining for a new story. I loved fairytales, myths, books, films, and it still goes on, this insatiable hungry for, "Tell me a story."

Kousha Navidar: That brings up a question that I was going to ask way later, but I feel like it's perfect right now. An element of your songs that resonates, I think, with a lot of people is the storytelling aspect of it. I think, on a lot of songs, I notice that sometimes it's the change in time signature that you choose to do that evokes that sense of stream-of-consciousness storytelling. Is there a conscious connection there with changing time signatures or is it just that's how it came out, that's what it is?

Regina Spektor: It's funny. So much of what I find out about my own music is from other people telling it to me. I think most of it is actually not very conscious. I do very much respect people who are always talking about the craft of songwriting and all that. I believe them. I know that somewhere in there, I have been gifted a music education by my teacher, and I have been gifted these skills so that I can go over to the piano and I could find things when I look for them instinctively or unconsciously, as opposed to just being a shadow artist, which is somebody who feels all the feelings and wants to make art, but just hasn't been given the skills to actually do it in whatever medium.

I'm so grateful for that because I think I would just be brimming with feeling and I wouldn't be able to get it out. As far as knowing what it is I do consciously, I've only found out from people in hindsight. They're like, "Oh, there's a flatted ninth." I'm like, "I don't even know what that means." It makes me feel like a musical idiot.

Kousha Navidar: Well, no, not idiot. I think just the pioneer, the one's creating. You're too busy creating it. [laughs] There's one song that comes to mind that does a lot of these things. It's Loveology. Oh, it's on your newest album. I'm hoping maybe you might have that one in your back pocket you could share with us.

Regina Spektor: Yes, of course.

Kousha Navidar: Before you play, is there a quick idea of what people should be listening to or something you really appreciate about this song?

Regina Spektor: That's so hard to talk about songs. I'm always just struck silent when I get asked questions. I know for a fact that the thing about this song that's so special to me is that I wrote it in my early 20s. I played it, I think, once or twice, and then I left it. Because, at that time in New York, there were people coming to my shows and they would record songs and they would put them up on the internet. These songs, even though they never got to be on a record or have this life of being fulfilled properly in a studio, had a life of their own. A lot of them were kept alive by fans and listeners sharing it.

Eventually, actually, this song came back into my life because people had been asking me about it for so long, that Jack, my husband, was like, "What is this song, Loveology? People keep asking about it." I figured out how to play it. I played it for him, and he was like, "You have to start putting that into your solo shows whenever you go and play solo." I tried, and I just re-met it, and it was really such a good feeling. [chuckles]

Kousha Navidar: Let's meet it right now.

Regina Spektor: Okay.

[MUSIC - Regina Spektor: Loveology]

Oh, an incurable humanist you are

Oh, an incurable humanist you are

You are, you are

Are you, are you

Oh, an incurable humanist you are

Oh, an incurable humanist

You, ooh, ooh, ooh

Are, are, are, are

You, ooh, ooh, ooh

Are, are, are, are

Let’s go to the movies

I will hum you a song about nothing at all

Let’s go Let's go to the movies

I will hum you a song about nothing at all

Let's go to the movies

Let's go to the movies

Nothing at all, nothing at all

Nothing at all, nothing at all

Oh, an incurable humanist you are

Oh, an incurable humanist

You, ooh, ooh, ooh

Are, are, are, are

You, ooh, ooh, ooh

Are, are, are, are

Let's go to the movies

I will sing you a song about nothing at all

Let's go to the movies

I will sing you a song about nothing at all

Let's go to the movies

Let's go to the movies

Nothing at all, nothing at all

Nothing at all, nothing at all

Sit down, class!

Open up your textbooks to page 42

Porcupine-ology, antler-ology

Car-ology, bus-ology

Train-ology, plane-ology

Mama-ology, papa-ology

You-ology, me-ology

Loveology, kiss-ology

Stay-ology, please-ology

Let's study, class

Let's study, class, sit down!

Loveology, loveology

I'm sorry-ology

Forgive me-ology

Loveology, loveology

I'm sorry-ology

Forgive me-ology

Loveology, loveology

Loveology, loveology

Let's study, class

Let's study, class, sit down!

Loveology, loveology

I'm sorry-ology

Forgive me-ology

Loveology, loveology

I'm sorry-ology

Forgive me-ology

Oh, an incurable humanist you are

Oh, an incurable humanist you are

I'm sorry, forgive me

Forgive me-ology

Forgive me, I'm sorry

I'm sorry-ology

Forgive me, forgive me

Forgive me-ology

Kousha Navidar: Wow. There's so much in that song that speaks to me about regret, but also where home is. It feels so perfect. Given that your latest album is called Home, Before and After and you're home for your tour. This is going to be a geeky question.

Regina Spektor: Yes. I love geeky questions. [chuckles]

Kousha Navidar: Well, you came to the right studio. You're talking a lot about home lately. Is there a chord or something on the piano that feels like home to you? You can say a chord, you can play something. Is there anything that, to you, when you play it, it feels like, "Ugh, that's where I sit."

Regina Spektor: Honestly, as you're talking, and I know there's no video here, you guys can't see it, but as he asked the question, I just put my hands right on the top of the piano, smushing the lid to that nice top. I think that just touching it right in this spot at the center just feels very grounding to me. I think that because I do get sometimes nervous or just this whole thing feels a little bit outside of my nature that when you do have such a nice, big, beautiful Steinway by your side and you can just go to it, it's almost like being friends with a huge whale or elephant or something. I think more than a chord, just touching the piano and being able to lean on it makes me feel, "Ah, I'm home."

Kousha Navidar: This is where I am.

Regina Spektor: Yes.

Kousha Navidar: I love that, because I think of it as chords, the sound that it makes, but for you, it's very tactile. It's where you sit. It's where you can hold on, kind of. Is that fair?

Regina Spektor: Yes. I think, actually, the touch of the piano and the keys, because actually, a lot of the time, I realized this again, only when I started doing television because they were like, "Do you ever open your eyes?" I was like, "Oh, no. I think I kind of don't." I really, most of the time, play with my eyes closed, and so, so much of the piano besides sound, it's just this kind of touch to me. I feel connected through that.

Kousha Navidar: That was my conversation with Regina Spektor on All Of It last summer. She and I talked for so long that we ran out of time to get to a third song Regina had prepared to perform, but she was kind enough to stick around and record the song for us. We wanted to share it with you. Here's Regina Spektor performing the song What Might Have Been from her latest album Home, Before and After.

[MUSIC - Regina Spektor: What Might Have Been]

Sickness and flowers go together

Bombing and shelters go together

Laughing and hurting go together

Finding and keeping go together

Canary yellow, mustard yellow

Yellow tear stains on old pillows

Everyone loves a story

About long, long ago

Pirates and parrots go together

Sticks and carrots go together

Loving and leaving go together

Lies and believing go together

Canary yellow, mustard yellow

Yellow tear stains on old pillows

Everyone loves a story

About far, far away

Living and dying go together

Business and crying go together

Passion and madness go together

Yellow and sadness go together

Canary yellow, mustard yellow

Yellow tear stains on old pillows

Everyone loves a story

About far, far away

Everyone loves a story

About long, long ago

And what, what might have been

Kousha Navidar: That was Regina Spektor performing What Might Have Been live in WNYC Studio 5 last summer. It's from her latest album Home, Before and After.