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[music]

Tiffany Hanssen: This is All Of It. I'm Tiffany Hanssen. Alison Stewart will be back tomorrow. Thanks for spending part of your day with us. Whether you're listening on the radio, live streaming, or on demand, I'm grateful you are here. On today's show, we'll fill up your podcast queue with suggestions from Nick Quah, Vulture's podcast critic. We'll talk with the head of the Lewis Latimer Museum in Queens about the inventor and the celebration planned for the 175th anniversary of Lattimer's birth. NPR TV critic Eric Deggans will join us to talk about what's going on with the actors and writers strikes, and with talk shows. We'll hear from singer-songwriter Devon Gilfillian, and who's on tour, and we'll be performing in our area later this month. That's the plan. Let's get started with some music from pianist Awadagin Pratt.

[MUSIC - Awadagin Pratt: Still Point]

You are listening to Still Point, the first piece on a new album of the same name from acclaimed pianist and educator Awadagin Pratt. Pratt entered the spotlight in the early 1990s after becoming the first triple major in the history of the prestigious Peabody Institute, the Music School of Johns Hopkins, where he earned degrees in piano, violin, and conducting. In the years since, he's performed on many of the most sought-after stages, including the White House for two different administrations. His new album STILLPOINT is his first release in 12 years and comprises six original pieces from six different composers. The name of the album is drawn from T.S. Eliot's Four Quartets, generally considered to be the author's last great work. Awadagin Pratt joins me now. Welcome to All Of It.

Awadagin Pratt: Thank you very much. Happy to be here.

Tiffany Hanssen: I first want to talk about T.S. Eliot. Obviously, it's the inspiration, as I said, for the album. These are four poems Eliot wrote over the span of six years. They appear in different collections. What about these particular poems, this collection spoke to you so much that it inspired this album?

Awadagin Pratt: Well, I can't really remember when I first came across the Four Quartets. I know it was when I was in college, and there's something very musical about the writing. I love the conflict, the tension in the lines in a lot of the poems, the four poems of well as is time present, time past, and time future, and the idea of opposing forces and creating the stillness, and the lines that I love and the stillness is the dance. I've had an affinity for the lines and the poems for a very, very long time and was happy that this album could present this opportunity to have composers comment, take inspiration from the lines.

Tiffany Hanssen: Do you think there's something about the works, the poems that speaks to us right now specifically?

Awadagin Pratt: Well, that's an interesting question. I think that art of any time, because in its essence it's about what qualities make us human and that it's kind of any piece of art-- I mean, I'm generalizing here, but it's a celebration in a way of the things that define us as human beings. What are the emotional, psychological, physical joys and challenges that we experience over the course of a lifetime? I tend to think that anything, any piece of art, most pieces of art are relevant throughout time. It's funny to say time, but this poem is no different.

Tiffany Hanssen: In the poem, 1 of the Four, Burnt Norton, you quote some of that in the liner notes for the album, and you say, "These lines have meant a lot to me over the years." So I'm wondering if you can read a little bit of that for us.

Awadagin Pratt: These five lines. Sure.

At the still point of the turning world. Neither flesh nor fleshless;

Neither from nor towards; at the still point, there the dance is,

But neither arrest nor movement. And do not call it fixity,

Where past and future are gathered. Neither movement from nor towards,

Neither ascent nor decline. Except for the point, the still point,

There would be no dance, and there is only the dance.

Tiffany Hanssen: The still point in the silence is the dance. Music is obviously intrinsically not silent. How do you express that silence in music?

Awadagin Pratt: Well, one of the great aspects of music is the silence. The music starts from silence, ends in silence, and then there are moments of silence in the rests that occur in music that are kind of the frames of the sound. Certainly, there is stillness in music and certainly an essential part of kind of the origin of music, I think, is in dance. I find that he having taken inspiration a lot from Beethoven Opus 132 string quartet which has those moments just incredibly powerfully, those aspects partly realized Beethoven. I think it's appropriate that he, in that reflection, has these lines, and they sort of recur throughout the four poems.

Tiffany Hanssen: You mentioned there's a musicality to his writing. Can we hear that in the musical translation, if I can call it that, that you have on this album of his words?

Awadagin Pratt: I think that the play of words of Eliot is similar to the play of ideas turning a motive upside down, having it go twice too slow, twice too fast, using the nature of repetition of ideas, the nature of a cyclical composition where ideas that are presented at the beginning sort of recur throughout the four poems. I think that Eliot, I mean, any piece of music that's written in a way is going to speak to or be aptly conversant with T.S. Eliot poems, because Eliot was using, playing with musical devices.

In the particular pieces of music, I think every composer addressed these lines in very different ways, and still managed to convey the essence of the lines and even with different sources of inspiration, for instance, Paola Prestini's piece took inspiration from letters, from T.S. Eliot and Emily Hale but sort of looked at it that way as a love story. Everyone just kind of had a different tact and approach but the works, I think, are just remarkable.

Tiffany Hanssen: Well, let's be clear for listeners. There are four poems in Eliot's collection, but there are six pieces on the album, so it's not that we're talking about one piece for every album. You've taken selected lines from these works, as I understand it.

Awadagin Pratt: Yes. Just the lines that I read at the beginning, those five lines are the point of departure for the composers, not the entire set of the poems.

Tiffany Hanssen: Got it. When you met with Judd Greenstein who contributed to the album and to the title track Still Point, how did that meeting go? What did you talk about when you first talked about this.

Awadagin Pratt: Well, Judd and I have a great history that began the genesis of the project a few years before when we met judging a competition at DePauw University with our 21CM program and Mark Rabideau. We had a long conversation about directions in new music. We met up at his farm to listen to composers and to discuss this, and after that meeting, because we were discussing all the various actors in this Roomful of Teeth and a string orchestra, and what's a unifying element going to be, and I thought these lines would be the unifying elements.

With Judd, he was so integral to the whole formation of the project and discussion about these lines initially. We didn't have a long conversation about what they meant and how he would take inspiration from them. He was synchronous with all of it.

Tiffany Hanssen: You say that the body of work on the album is really based on these five lines. Aside from just reading those lines and thinking about that, let's listen to a little bit more Still Point here in a second, but is that what you imagine people thinking about while they're listening to this, or are you trying to evoke some other thoughts based not on the lines, just what would you like to imagine I'm thinking about when I'm listening to this?

Awadagin Pratt: It's interesting for me to have a theme, a set of ideas like this as the centerpiece or throughline of these compositions because inherently, just personally when I perform a piece, I think one of the great things about there not being any vocal component, any words is that people are free to absorb it in whatever way that it hits them, and it'll hit them different on a Monday than a Friday, and each person sitting next to each other is going to hear the piece, whatever it is differently.

I have received some comments from people that because of the title and because of the poem, that they are listening with those ideas in mind, I think, which is unavoidable, and then they're finding points of resonance with those themes in the music.

Tiffany Hanssen: Well, let's listen to it a little bit and see what we think about it here on a Thursday.

[laughter]

[MUSIC - Awadagin Pratt: Still Point]

Well, we're hearing a lot there that's not just you playing the piano. Let's first talk about the other two components there, the strings and the voices we're hearing. There are two different groups. Do you want to tell us a little bit about them?

Awadagin Pratt: A Far Cry is the string orchestra. I didn't know them initially, but they came highly recommended and it turns out that several members of the band had played with me in other circumstances, and were excited to collaborate, and we had a really fantastic journey because we premiered the pieces in Cincinnati about a month before. Sorry, it's probably a month before the recording. They're conductorless, and it's complicated, and we really worked through in their process, learning the scores, and it was really terrific. Then Roomful of Teeth, again, I didn't know personally at all.

Tiffany Hanssen: Roomful of Teeth is the vocal group, we heard that.

Awadagin Pratt: The vocal group, eight-member vocal group. They were just absolutely superb as you can hear, and they do their own distinctive way of vocalizing that they created altogether. As musicians do, never having met before and just coming together and working incredibly hard in one direction, we got lucky that we were all calibrated, working in the same way and process, and it was a really joyous experience.

Tiffany Hanssen: Very briefly, I want to just circle back to Judd Greenstein before we get too far from him. There are six pieces on this album, each from a different composer, each of whom has a very specific style. Before we leave Judd too far in the rearview mirror, how would you describe his style?

Awadagin Pratt: Well, Judd, I think he was more of a pianist than, I hope I'm right saying this, than most of the other composers. There was something in terms of the feel and the way that he used the instrument technically that was really gratifying as a pianist. His language is, I have described it recently just thinking about it, it's like a Copeland of our time. There's something I think that his sound, his melodies, his technique in terms of usage of instruments and devices is really resonant with the variety of music that exists right now in what would be called American culture, from hip hop through to John Adams and Philip Glass. I find that he has a singular voice that just I love. There's a melody through this that I just feel has that open spaces kind of feel that Copeland often had. I really enjoyed playing it.

Tiffany Hanssen: If you're just joining us, we're talking with Awadagin Pratt, acclaimed pianist and educator about his new album called STILLPOINT. Awadagin, when we come back from the break, we'll talk about Alvin Singleton, and let's go out a little bit here on Time Past, Time Future.

[MUSIC - Alvin Singleton: Time Past, Time Future]

[music]

This is All Of It. I'm Tiffany Hanssen in for Alison Stewart, who will be back tomorrow. I'm talking with pianist educator, Awadagin Pratt about his new album STILLPOINT, his first release in 12 years. Awadagin, this has six pieces from six composers on this album. I'll have you run through the list, and then I think we'll end if we can start talking about. I said we were going to start talking about Alvin Singleton, so let's do that. The other composers are Judd Greenstein, who we talked about, and Jesse Montgomery?

Awadagin Pratt: Jesse Montgomery, Paola Prestini.

Tiffany Hanssen: Pēteris.

Awadagin Pratt: Alvin and Pēteris Vasks.

Tiffany Hanssen: That's it. Pēteris, Tyshawn Sorey, and Alvin.

Awadagin Pratt: Tyshawn, yes.

Tiffany Hanssen: Yes. The piece that we heard before the break, Time Past, Time Future, was composed by Alvin. He's a Brooklyn-born composer, former Fulbright scholar. How did you connect with him, and specifically around this?

Awadagin Pratt: I met Alvin early in my career in the early '90s when I was playing with the Atlanta Symphony. He lives there, and he'd been composer-in-residence there. I'd known his name. We met briefly, and we corresponded briefly around that time. I always remembered him. I liked his music over a period of time from that point onwards. When we started thinking about this, I thought of Alvin pretty much immediately. I was happy when he was excited about the project and to write for me.

Tiffany Hanssen: We talk about Judd being a little Copeland-ish. How would you describe Alvin's style?

Awadagin Pratt: This piece, I think in some ways, is emblematic in ways, and also somewhat of, I don't know if you would agree, a departure from other trends in his writing, but there's a real, I think, jazz influence in a lot of his music, and I think that's reflected in this piece in the faster parts, the dance-like parts, if you will, or the high energy sections and volume. There's a big contrast in volume in this piece. I think there's an illusion towards jazz is present in a lot of his music. I think he also captures the still quality of this, the stillness incredibly well with these very slow moving and very quiet chords.

Tiffany Hanssen: When you said, I've got these four T.S. Eliot poems, and [chuckles] I pulled this line out of it, and what did he say? Was he like, "Excellent." [chuckles]

Awadagin Pratt: Yes, I think he was like, cool [laughs]. We were on a phone call, but most of it was happening. All of this was happening during the lockdown or parts of it. Let's see. Well, some part of it was in terms of once the process was started. Yes, we didn't have an extended conversation about it, really. I think he was familiar and just for the hard part.

Tiffany Hanssen: Got it. You weren't having to put on the hard cell [laughs].

Awadagin Pratt: No, I was fortunate that there was nobody that I had no arms to be twisted. We didn't get everybody that we thought about initially. People had other commitments, but the ones we got are phenomenal.

Tiffany Hanssen: I want to listen-- We listen to it a little bit, but let's listen to it a little bit more of this Time Past, Time Future,

[MUSIC - Alvin Singleton: Time Past, Time Future]

Tiffany Hanssen: Were you thinking about time differently while you were recording this? Thinking about future time, past time differently?

Awadagin Pratt: No, I was counting [laughter], and listening to the orchestra with these chords. I wasn't really, to be honest, reflecting on the title. If you had to say probably maybe the slower parts are time past and the faster parts are time future, but that might be a little overly simplistic. I don't know.

Tiffany Hanssen: Do you-- I don't know. This is just a layperson's view, but in the piano part of that, I heard a little, I don't know, sort of Bach.

Awadagin Pratt: Yes.

Tiffany Hanssen: Okay, good. [laughs]

Awadagin Pratt: Yes, the lines, interplay of lines there. Absolutely. Yes, I think that's a big influence for him.

Tiffany Hanssen: If there were another selection that we could have time to get to here that might represent a little bit of a different style than what we've already heard, should we go to Paola Prestini?

Awadagin Pratt: Yes, sure.

Tiffany Hanssen: Okay. Paola is the co-founder of the music organization National Sawdust. This piece is called Code. Have you two worked together before this project?

Awadagin Pratt: No, we haven't. I'm friends with her husband, Jeffrey Zeigler, who's the cellist, formerly of Kronos. He had told me some time ago that Paola was a fan of mine. I think we briefly crossed time at Peabody and wanted to write for me, and I had a CD of her music, which I enjoyed quite a bit. Again, she came to mind quickly when we started the project.

Tiffany Hanssen: We talked about her at the open a little bit here because her piece, as she explains it, was inspired by the relationship between T.S. Eliot and Emily Hale. Emily Hale, of course, a drama teacher, had a relationship, we don't really know, I guess, what it was like, an emotional relationship with T.S. Eliot for more than a couple of decades. What did she-- I know I'm asking you to speak for her, but what do you think she drew out of that relationship and put into this music?

Awadagin Pratt: I think that there was a complexity of narrative because when Emily Hale gave the letters, I think it was to Princeton, to be open 50 years after the last of them died, he said, "This woman hadn't meant that much to me," and he burned her letters, and we were left, or those that knew about it were left to wait and see what was going to be revealed. What was revealed was much more than he had owned up to. Much more intense, much more close.

Tiffany Hanssen: That sounds like a show in and of itself [laughs].

Awadagin Pratt: Right [laughs]. I think Paola was interested in the love aspect there, but also she said, which I still have been-- She called it Code because there's a name spelled out in the music, in the score of an unknown lover, right? That unknown lover aspect that Eliot was trying to hide from his first wife, I think was dead by then, but it's just sort of he felt an embarrassment. I think that's where she was taking inspiration from that, and yet telling a story of almost the birth of a love, the life of the love, and the end of the love all in one piece.

Tiffany Hanssen: Let's hear a little bit of that.

[MUSIC: Awadagin Pratt/Paola Prestini- Code]

Tiffany Hanssen: That is Code, one of the six pieces written for the new album by Awadagin Pratt, that piece written by Paola Prestini. There are six on the album. We've only touched on a few, but I really appreciate the conversation with you today, Awadagin.

Awadagin Pratt: Thank you. I've enjoyed it as well, and happy to be on the station.

Tiffany Hanssen: Awadagin Pratt's new album is called STILLPOINT. It's his first release in 12 years, and he joined us today to talk about it.

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