Alison Stewart: This is All Of It on WNYC. I'm Alison Stewart. The description for the casting notice read Broadway Othello, set in the future, starring two unnamed A-listers, American accents only. We soon learned that playing Shakespeare's Moorish general would be Denzel Washington and his scheming right-hand man would be Jake Gyllenhaal with Kenny Leon directing. In fact, we had Kenny on the show right after that announcement was made last summer.

Kenney Leon: Around the time we end home, I'll start our town rehearsals and then go into Othello--

Alison Stewart: With Denzel.

Kenney Leon: And Jake Gyllenhaal in January. I'm looking forward to that.

Alison Stewart: Any word on Desdemona?

Kenney Leon: Oh, yes, we cast her.

Alison Stewart: Who is it?

Kenney Leon: We cast her.

Alison Stewart: Oh, who is it? We've cast her.

[laughter]

Kenney Leon: She is wonderful. But we can't announce it until September.

Alison Stewart: Okay. The news came a little sooner. Molly Osborne would play Desdemona, the loving wife of Othello, and the objective of Iago's manipulation. A native of Essex, Molly was working as a 20-something actor in the UK, receiving good notices on the West End. But it was a tape that she made for Othello that changed her career. Now this is a tough ticket. There are a lot of lotteries. The premiere was a star-studded event. Spike Lee, Colman Domingo, even former President Biden were on hand.

But take away all the gloss, it is one of great Shakespeare's greatest tragedies and one of his greatest plays. Molly Osborne is on stage as Desdemona in Othello at the Ethel Barrymore Theatre. She joins me now in the studio. Hi, Molly.

Molly Osborne: Hi.

Alison Stewart: That was funny to hear.

Molly Osborne: That was so funny to hear. Oh my goodness. That takes me back. Like I can't believe it's been a whole year since I sent those tapes in and now here we are. Very surreal. [laughs]

Alison Stewart: Before you sent the tapes in, before you even thought about auditioning for Othello, what were you working on?

Molly Osborne: Oh my goodness. Auditioning here, there, and everywhere for whatever I could get my hands on with my lovely agents and my lovely manager and just temping and working other little jobs to pay the rent.

Alison Stewart: You were a working actor. You had gigs, side gigs.

Molly Osborne: Yes, that's right. Absolutely. As everyone does, as the game really, isn't it?

Alison Stewart: What was the role that made you realize I'm going to be an actor?

Molly Osborne: Oh my goodness. Great question. I don't know. Maybe youth theater roles, I guess. I think the first thing I did in a really big theater-- it felt really big at the time. The Mercury Theatre in Colchester, where I grew up, which is such an amazing theater to have as a teen. There was an Am Dram production of The Sound of Music that I auditioned for and got into to play Liesl, I think.

I think it was then watching everyone do their thing, even just people who are stage management, people who are working front of house, the people who are working building the sets, realizing that it was a viable job option to work in the arts in any sense. I think that's when I realized that I really wanted to study and I really wanted to be in the theater industry or in the film industry in some capacity. Then, I guess was lucky enough to get into drama school and have a lot of very nice people open some very nice doors for me.

Alison Stewart: I heard or I read somewhere that you were a flatmate of one of the members of Operation Mincemeat?

Molly Osborne: Correct. He's actually with me, staying with me here in New York now. plaughs] I'm going to meet them afterwards and he's going to watch the Broadway production tonight. He was covering when they were first in the West End and then took over the role when they then came to Broadway.

Alison Stewart: They're so funny.

Molly Osborne: It's such a great show. I absolutely adore it.

Alison Stewart: They were on earlier this week. They were hilarious.

Molly Osborne: They're so funny. They're brilliant.

Alison Stewart: All right. You saw the description. Broadway Othello, set in the future, starring two unnamed A-listers, American accents only. How did you prepare? What did you prepare?

Molly Osborne: I think it was two scenes from the play that they had sent and then two other monologues from any Shakespeare play of my choice. Then a little clip just like-- I think the brief was, say a funny story about yourself. I had a few other tapes to do that weekend, and I honestly saw the Breakdown and I was like, sure. I really didn't think. I was super, super thrilled to have the audition come through, but I really didn't think, particularly as it was going to be American accents, I thought I'm really not going to be their gal for this one.

I always think that works in my favor when you just do the work and then you move on. That's what I did for that. I just did one or two takes for each of the scenes and told a very silly story that down the line I couldn't quite believe was being sent to Denzel Washington to watch, to approve. Really, really wild. It was a few weeks in between each interaction, and it was a few weeks after I sent the tapes and said bye-bye, see you. That'll be out in the ether somewhere, so maybe someone will see it.

Then I met Kenny a few weeks later and we sat down for a few hours. That was just amazing in itself to spend some time with him and speak to him about his process. It was so lovely.

Alison Stewart: What did you think when you found out you got the role of Desdemona?

Molly Osborne: I really was in denial about it for a long time. I don't tend to celebrate things until I see it in writing which was actually months and months and months later. I think like throughout last summer, it was sinking in that it was happening, and then was getting FaceTimes from Denzel and was just laughing down the phone what is happening right now? [laughs] Very, very surreal. I think once I got here and we started rehearsals was really when it landed that this was actually happening.

Alison Stewart: My guest is Molly Osborne. She plays Desdemona in Othello, now running on Broadway. Before being in Othello, what did you understand the play of Othello to be? Now that you have been through it, have been through rehearsals, have appeared on stage, what do you understand about it now?

Molly Osborne: I studied it in high school and when I got the tape through, I've actually had the playtext from when I was in year 10 or when I was like 15, had all these little notes of of the play that as looking back now, I really didn't get the depth of it as a 15-year-old. I guess every time you revisit a play as you grow, you relate to things more. Of course, studying at school, I guess I knew all of those themes of that it's about jealousy and betrayal, and love.

I think now approaching it, particularly as Kenny sets it in the near future as well, it's about love in a war zone and it's about that betrayal that we can watch now and see reflected in the politics of today. It's really amazing that a play that's over 400 years old can still be so relevant and we can still find new meanings in it all the time as we all grow as well. I think that's such a great choice to set it so slightly separated from now, but in a way where we can see ourselves mirrored back to us.

Alison Stewart: Desdemona is a woman of Venice, the daughter of a senator. Your Desdemona has some agency.

Molly Osborne: Definitely. I think, to answer your last question as well, finding that agency and finding a connection with the character Amelia is something I didn't quite clock as well when I was younger.

Alison Stewart: Interesting.

Molly Osborne: How that's been portrayed in this play and how Amelia is in the military herself and how, as an audience member, you get to watch them as two women in the play, really balance each other out where Amelia has this gravitas and this experience which Desdemona lacks. Yet Desdemona has this hope for the good and she has such a good heart, and she comes from a place of love.

Watching them balance each other out and learn from each other, and grow together in this production is really beautiful thing. I feel like I'm learning a lot as well, doing the production. As a young woman in this industry, I'm taking inspiration from that and feeling empowered by that, which is really cool.

Alison Stewart: It's set in the near future. Desdemona has tailored suits. She wears pants suits. How would you describe what she's wearing? Then how does the costuming help you get into character?

Molly Osborne: Oh, definitely. Dede Ayite has designed the costumes, and they are very powerful. Initially, she wears heels the whole time, which I actually don't think I've ever done a job where that's the case.

Alison Stewart: Wow.

Molly Osborne: I got these big heels and strutting about. I was finding this physicality, actually, that really reflects her status and her privilege, where she comes from and who her father is, and where she's in that social bubble almost that gets burst throughout the play. It has been really great to find that almost strut and waftiness to her through the costumes. Also, they're just fabulous to wear.

Alison Stewart: What does your Desdemona-- What does she think of her marriage to Othello?

Molly Osborne: What I love about Desdemona is love is love for her. It's just very simple, I think. I think the fuss that's made about it in the beginning of the play. You're marrying this man and there's these misogynist undertones, racist undertones in those first few scenes of the play. I think Desdemona represents that hope for change and how we're working towards a world where those things are washed away and we don't judge each other in that way. I think she just believes in the good in people, and I think love is love for her.

Alison Stewart: I've got my college text of Othello here.

Molly Osborne: You do.

Alison Stewart: This line, Desmona says, "My noble father, I do perceive here a divided duty. To you, I am bound for life and education. My life and education both do learn me how to respect you. You are the lord of duty. I am hitherto your daughter, but here is my husband and so much duty, as my mother showed to you, preferring you before her father so much. I challenge that I may profess, due to the more, My lord." Why does she want to defy her father so much?

Molly Osborne: Interestingly, I think in this speech, she's very diplomatic.

Alison Stewart: She is.

Molly Osborne: She's very clever. She goes towards her father, having rejected him and gone behind his back. But she goes towards him and speaks to him in a way where he will understand and uses the evidence. That's all true. It's all out there. With one very short speech, she manages to convince him and the entire room that his behavior is inappropriate and is not right at all. It shuts him up, which is fun to do. What was the actual question you asked me? Sorry.

Alison Stewart: Why does she defy her father? Your point is she's very elegant in the way she defies.

Molly Osborne: Exactly. Yes. There's some of her youth comes through there where she and some immaturity, I guess. She's in her early 20s in this production that we're doing, and I guess she's in a bit of a rebellious stage, and she doesn't feel the need to get approval from her father anymore, which I think is very modern, of course, and she can validate that for herself, and she can have her own autonomy and make her own choices.

Alison Stewart: My guest is Molly Osbourne. She plays Desdemona in Othello, now running on Broadway. You're working with two very well-known actors, Denzel Washington as Othello and Jake Gyllenhaal as Iago. What advice did Kenny Leon give you about working with experienced actors?

Molly Osborne: Oh, my goodness. The support he gave really was letting us be who we are, I think, which is such a beautiful thing. Kenny has such a beautiful heart and comes from such a great place. It's such an honor and a privilege to be in that room and to observe and have the opportunity to watch and learn from the greats and see how they run the room and what they do in their process.

To be able to be around that and absorb that is just such a gift and what any actor could ever hope for, let alone partake in it as well, and also play in the scenes with them. Once we'd like really gotten to know each other, we could really-- we still are. It's all very alive. Even now, we can really start to play with the material and let it be.

Alison Stewart: In the play, your character takes on such hate for the man she loves. What's going through Desdemona's mind as she's experienced this hate from others, but then also from her husband?

Molly Osborne: The hate she gets for who she loves. To me, I feel I channel not rising to it because it's ignorance in that sense. Then the hate that she gets from Othello-- I think we also went down this avenue where we were really exploring what it is like to be in the military and in the Marines and be fighting for your country in a war zone and what that can do to you and what PTSD can do to you.

I feel like that turn in the second act where the conflict begins between Othello and Desdemona is molded around that fact of looking at this man who has seen war and has been through it and seeing the effects of that. I fear for him. I worry about him. I think she does. I think she initially doesn't think it's to do with her, which becomes her downfall. It's very interesting to tread that line because the second act is a very lean hour and it is a slippery slope. It's very nuanced. It's great fun to dissect and really get into.

Alison Stewart: We get to hear you sing.

Molly Osborne: Yes. With the amazing Kimber Elayne Sprawl.

Alison Stewart: Are you a theater kid?

Molly Osborne: Yes. I am. I trained in musical theater, so I don't know how I managed to get here doing Shakespeare play, [laughs[] which is my dream to do. I've always, always admired actors who work on Shakespeare. Yes. Theatre kids through and through.

Alison Stewart: We'll get to hear you sing one day, I'm sure on Broadway.

Molly Osborne: I hope so. [laughs]

Alison Stewart: My guest has been Molly Osborne. She's playing Desdemona in Othello, now running on Broadway. Really nice to meet you.

Molly Osborne: You, too. Thanks so much for having me.